More Roy Halladay Rumors: Angels Edition

by Tom Dakers on Dec 9, 2009 9:41 PM EST in Toronto Blue Jays News

Bob Elliot, not quite a Hall of Famer for the second year in a row, (which is really too bad, I thought he'd have it this year) comes through with an actual rumor of an offer from the Angels for Roy Halladay. The offer is lefty pitcher Joe Saunders, shortstop Erick Aybar and center fielder Peter Bourjos. You can click on their names to get more information about each, but here is a little:

Aybar is 26, hit .312/.353/.423 last year with 5 homers and 14 steals, though he was caught 7 times so his base stealing was kind of a break even thing. He had a UZR/150 of 7.6 so he's decent defensively. His WAR value was 3.8, he's just coming up to his prime years and he has 3 seasons left before he can be a free agent. He'd fill the leadoff role for the team too.
Saunders is 28 and had a 16-7 record and a 4.60 ERA in 2009 after a 17-6 and 3.41 ERA in 2008. He doesn't strike out many, 4.9/ 9 last year, so I'd be worried that he wouldn't be able to keep up that win/loss record, but he's been a good pitcher up till now. He has three more seasons before he can become a free agent.
Peter Bourjos is 23 and played Double-A ball last year. He hit .281/.354/.423 in Arkansas last year. He stole 32 bases last year, and 50 the year before. He has a good reputation for defense and would allow the Jays to mover Vernon Wells to a corner spot in the outfield.

The deal would give us a surplus of shortstops but Alex Gonzalez' contract isn't a bad one, I'm sure Alex could find a deal out there so him somewhere. I think I'd rather have Jesus Montero, as I think he could be a terrific batter, but I'm not sure the Yankees would part with him. We could do a lot worse than this deal.

I am guessing that this deal isn't that close to happening, Jordan Bastian has twittered that Alex Anthopoulos said that a deal is unlikely to happen during the meetings, but if the deal is on the table that's a good thing.

Poll

Would you trade Doc for Aybar, Saunders and Bourjas?

Yes

169 votes

No

142 votes

311 votes | Poll has closed

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Comments

Switch Weaver for Saunders, perhaps?

by Jevant on Dec 9, 2009 9:50 PM EST reply actions

I'd prefer Weaver too

we have a ton of lefties already and Weaver goes deeper into games and strikes guys out, as well as being a couple of years younger. Not sure the the Angels would do that, but I’d ask.

by Tom Dakers on Dec 9, 2009 9:55 PM EST up reply actions

+1

Jared Weaver is nasty. This would accomplish 2 things
1) Bona Fide #1 starter
2) We wouldn’t need to face him anymore :)

I’m not sure Saunders Aybar and some prospect is enough for Doc.

Johnnie Morton: The Man. The Myth. The Legend.

by craig in calgary on Dec 9, 2009 10:22 PM EST up reply actions

Im sure the Jays cant get what Halladay is exactly worth.

So im guessing you need this trade unless the Jays are really into trading within the division.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions

Well since this one would be, likely, for one year of Halladay....

I’m not sure how much more he would be worth.

by Tom Dakers on Dec 9, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions

Thats what I was thinking, but Angels don't want a rental.

I dont represent the angels but thats what has been said, “the angels would want Halladay only if an extension can be done”.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 10:40 PM EST up reply actions

true of any team, I would assume. Of course the Jays should not be asking for much in value for a one year stint with Roy.

Are we not operating under the assumption that the counterparty to these trades will negotiate an extension with Roy? The Jays have already indicated that they are ok with other teams negotiating with Roy (and frankly, I cannot see why they would say no, since it is only to the Jays’ benefit to have Roy work out a long-term deal with the counterparty)

by aagoodfella on Dec 9, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions

Everyone wins in this trade.

Halladay wont be in the AL east. Aybar and Bourjos are good pieces to build around, you already have some dudes with pop, Lind and Hill. I am surprised that a catcher is not involved in this, but hey you cant win them all you can lose them all.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 11:07 PM EST up reply actions

If this is accepted as being for only a year, the Angels are probably slightly overpaying. I think the question should be ‘Is this package better than two first round picks and likely the approximate market value?’. I think likely it is.

One nice thing is if this is on the table, the Yankees need to pony up a significant offer quickly, or this one is worth taking without regrets.

by dexfarkin on Dec 9, 2009 11:25 PM EST up reply actions

yea, I figure the two most likely teams are NYY and LAA, unless a dark horse shows up

by aagoodfella on Dec 9, 2009 11:28 PM EST up reply actions

To be honest, this is where you could use the statement from Doc’s agents as a plus. AA sits down with the Yankees and the Dodgers and says ‘Look, here’s the deal. Doc gave us a deadline that I can’t change. I’ve got a worthwhile package on the table. If you want the same terms, we’ve already said what we like in your system. We’re going to close with the Angels on Friday. If you’re serious, have a firm offer to us by then.’

by dexfarkin on Dec 9, 2009 11:34 PM EST up reply actions

Oh, I'll make you a firm offer

—George Oscar Bluth

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Dec 10, 2009 12:03 AM EST up reply actions

Ahh man gotta love Arrested Development.

Tobias’ analrapist card.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 10, 2009 12:09 AM EST up reply actions

Switch Aybar with Wood

by bunner on Dec 9, 2009 9:55 PM EST reply actions

ROFL!

are you serious?

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 9:59 PM EST up reply actions

yes...

however I did mean that along with the above comment of including Weaver instead of Saunders…I like Wood’s power potential a lot more then Aybar’s overall potential

by bunner on Dec 9, 2009 10:56 PM EST up reply actions

Well yeah Wood can be one hell of a player.

But passing on Aybar due to thinking Wood can be the next Longoria might be wishful thinking.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 11:02 PM EST up reply actions

This Would Be My Trade

I know people are high on Montero and Hughes, and for good reason, but this is the trade I’d make. It gets Roy out of the AL East. It includes an above average shortstop for a position we need and have been very weak at for years. Saunders is an adaquate pitcher and has faced the East before. He’s not brilliant, but I think you know exactly what you are getting with him, which is a solid and largely proven mid-rotation guy. Weaver and Santana have a more upside, certainly, but if I couldn’t get either back from them instead of Saunders, I wouldn’t kill the deal over it.

I’m very big on Bourjas, and I think he’s only a year or so away. Plus defender, lots of speed, decent enough OBP through the minors to be a leadoff guy if he can carry it into the majors. Kind of an Ellsbury sort of player, which the Jays could use at the top of the lineup. We also face a number of weak throwing catchers, which the Jays should be running on more.

This deal, assuming it all pans out, means the Jays also have a year to shake out Encarnacion and see what he really can do, vet Ruiz properly, and see what pieces they have going into a much stronger post 2010 free agent and see what adding some money into the payroll could get us.

by dexfarkin on Dec 9, 2009 10:00 PM EST reply actions

they can keep Sanders

Unless they’re looking to flip sanders, I wouldn’t ask for him. I’d replace him with Reckling and another pitching prospect. (I’m thinking Richards isn’t eligible to be traded yet).

by ayjackson on Dec 9, 2009 10:27 PM EST reply actions

I'm not sure Bourjos is much more than Mastoianni,

but then I’m bullish on Mastroianni.

by ayjackson on Dec 9, 2009 10:39 PM EST reply actions

I’d take Reckling over Saunders. Not too high on Aybar either.

Reckling, Wood, Aybar and that other dude not named Joe Saunders in the reported deal.

by BenjiDoc on Dec 9, 2009 10:52 PM EST via mobile reply actions

Well I think the Jays dont have the upper hand anymore

With Philly’s GM coming out and saying he cant go out and get a premier starting pitcher. With Boston not willing to give up Bucholtz, or just giving him up to NY for Montero and AAAA pitchers like Hughes or Joba. Saunders is no chump, the dude is from the east coast. Dude can pitch in the AL East. But would you really want Weaver who’s agent is Scott Boras or Ervin Santana who can be an ace but sometimes just likes to put you in deep holes giving up 4-7 runs on a bad start.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 11:01 PM EST up reply actions

no, he's a chump

by ayjackson on Dec 9, 2009 11:10 PM EST up reply actions

haha he's a chump.

I don’t know dude, I guess he will have to show you when hes you no.2 pitcher come 2010 ;)

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 9, 2009 11:16 PM EST up reply actions

There’s nothing about Joe Saunders that tells me he is a No. 2 starter. Plus, he is 28 years old.

by BenjiDoc on Dec 9, 2009 11:20 PM EST via mobile up reply actions

he has pretty good command.

so as long as he hits his spot, he should be a nice surprise for you.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Dec 10, 2009 12:20 AM EST up reply actions

I would take the guy with electric stuff that can be an ace.

by BenjiDoc on Dec 9, 2009 11:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions

Carl Pavano was from the East Coast

he didn’t do so well in the AL East. Regardless of where Saunders is from, his stuff doesn’t scream AL East to me at all. I think he’d be a mid-rotation starter, and the Jays have a lot of those.

"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman

by hugo on Dec 10, 2009 10:23 AM EST up reply actions

on BIG LEAGUE STEW, Jon Heyman is quoting another GM.

concerning the rumored LAA – Halladay deal

Heyman said (at 11:23) : one competing gm on angels’ reported offer for #halladay of saunders, aybar & bourjos: "(jays) should take it.’’

by aagoodfella on Dec 9, 2009 11:30 PM EST reply actions

Of course...

…remember that Heyman hates the Jays and will do everything in his power to ensure they get the worst possible deal done.

Whether he could actually do that is unlikely…i just hate Heyman.

by Jevant on Dec 10, 2009 1:00 AM EST up reply actions

Jays should take this forsure

If they could get another young pitching prospect thrown in that would be great because i really dont want to have a rotation made up of #3 starters after Doc is gone.

Aybar is good and can hit leadoff, we really need some athletic ability in CF, and Saunders doesnt suck, so i dont think we can do much better unless the Jays can get something from the Yanks with Montero, Hughes, and 2 other good hitting prospects.

Onions Baby Onions

by ohmybosh on Dec 10, 2009 12:09 AM EST reply actions

fer sure we are getting close to pulling the trigger on one of these deals — they are all respectable offers, albeit RUMORED offers, but none makes you want to jump and grab it, not quite yet, IMHO

by aagoodfella on Dec 10, 2009 12:35 AM EST up reply actions