Nah Not Doing a Recap....What Would You Do to Break the Slump?
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 5:09 PM EDT
in Game Recaps
107 comments
Jays lost. No Jay of Day but Tallet, Wells and Overbay get honorable mention. Suckage are Ryan (-.153), Rolen (-.126) (not counting a couple of misplays in the field), Hill (-.122) and Barajas (-.113). Honorable Suckage mention to Lind who was 0 for 3 and is as cold as it is possible to be and still be able to hold a bat.
So folks.....two weeks ago Cito was god, he could walk on water. And I still, in spite of glaring evidence to the opposite, think he is a great batting coach. But it isn't working (he says in the biggest understatement in my almost year on BBB). So folks...let's play a game. Cito has called you, he can't figure what to do to get us out of this slide, what do you think _______? (insert your name there). Cito's a nice guy, he'll use your first name.
Whenever Cito calls me he uses my first name. Well for awhile there he called me Rincewind for some reason. I remember the first time he called me. He said 'Tom, we are in a tight one, I'm thinking I'm going to pinch hit for Carter, should I?" I said "No Cito, he can hit Williams, no problem." That one worked out well.
Now being real he isn't going to change around the batting lineup and honest no one is hitting well so you can change the batting order all you want, you ain't going to make runs happen. So what do you tell him? A personal opinion is that guys should have had a game off by now. Scutaro, Hill, Wells and Rios have played every game and have only had two off days this year. How many of you have only had two off days since the start of April. Mental health breaks are good things.
Me? I'm saying no batting practice for a week. Take the guys out tonight and get them drunk. Get them to forget baseball for 24 hours.
Now be fair....don't tell him to make a trade and then turtle when he asks what for who? I don't think there is one guy out there that could change our team (Babe Ruth is still dead right?) and no matter what you may think, our pitching prospects may look good to us fans but if you want to trade some of them, explain why another team would think they are good.
Yes I'd trade Ray and Mills but no team would give me something for them, so make it real. Litsch has trade value, except he is injured. So he doesn't. Cecil might have value but he's still transitioning from College reliever to starter, his value is more to us than to anyone, and he isn't high up other folks prospect list.
Anyway I'll put up a poll but use the comments to explain.
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Minnesota Viking Style love boat?
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 5:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey Cito....when I sent you Craig's email address....
forget it, k?
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Johnny Mac catching and batting 4th?
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 5:17 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Raul Chavez batting lead off and playing Centre field
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 5:17 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
"Barajas tries to knock Brian Roberts into left field on a slide into second on a double. Boy did he go in hard. (AP Photo/Nick Wass) "
Thats what she said
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 5:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
correction
“Boy did [Big Rod] go in hard.”
by boo15749 on May 25, 2009 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Make Rios the new mascot
and turn Ryan into glue.
by Minlen on May 25, 2009 6:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
you do know rios has the most second most homers on the team this month right?
why the guy batting .273 for the month and not ummmm Lind hitting .212 over the last 12 games…actually lower now with today’s game. Or any of the others not hitting during this slide?
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably because Lind has been hitting way better then Rios throughout the course of the season
Geez, and you talk about others using small sample sizes for statistics but thats exactly what you are doing here!
In the grand scheme of things, the pain of life is not worth it.
by adamgreuel on May 25, 2009 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Missing the point....
I’m saying that people want Lind in the 4 spot because of the small sample size that make it look like he is batting better than the other guys. Suggesting that the larger sample from like last year might be more worth looking at than the small sample from this year.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hmmm
Do you think last years stats are more relavent than this years. The sample this year is not that small and it is current. Besides didn’t Lind have half decent numbers last year? Is this an attempt to divert attention from your guys Wells and Rios. “Boy Linds been bad this week
quit riding my guys”. Even if he had their contracts you can’t logically put him down and brag on up the boys.
by Piccasso on May 25, 2009 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't have guys.... I like Lind.....
just think that a full season stats is worth more than a month’s worth. Lind didn’t hit a homer after the late August last year. He had a hot month, he’s having a far less hot month now….I don’t think either is all the statistically significant.
You can try to frame it as I hate one and like the other all you want.
And if you want to try to be insulting, do it somewhere else.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't
mean to be insulting. Just ponting out your current bias.
by Piccasso on May 25, 2009 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My bias is sample size...
saying someone is my guy is trying to be insulting….You think a month of stats is more significant than a season. You won’t have a job in the majors long.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what are you talking about?
we both love Lind. Maybe you weren’t around this offseason when it was trendy for everyone to say that Lind was nothing, based on his lackluster performance at the end of the year last season. We were both beating the Lind drum and saying that he would make the necessary adjustments and be a productive major-league hitter in 2009.
Countering silly arguments about Wells and Rios by pointing out that everyone slumps and gets hot and using Lind’s recent performance as an example is just pointing out the obvious, not ragging on Lind. It just shows the absurdity of getting on a hitter for a few bad weeks because if you’re going to do that, you’ll be out of players to root for very quickly.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
by hugo on May 26, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
All Joking aside
Why not try shuffling up the lineup.
Maybe there is too much on guys like Rios, Wells and Lind to produce and too much pressure on Scoot and Aaron to get on. Why not flip it on its head? It can’t hurt?
Does this really look that bad?
Wells
Scoot
Hill
Lind
Rios
Rolen
Overbay
Barajas
Bautista/Millar/Lunchbox
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 6:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
lind isn't hitting anything.....and you know the answer...
Cito isn’t going to change the order and then no one is hitting so why do it?
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats my point
No one is hitting. Flip the thing on its head.
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
-scoot belongs at 1, because of OBP
-Hill’s HR streak is / was not sustainable so it is probably a mistake to move him into a power hitting position
-so I would leave them at 1-2 …
I could see some argument for Wells, Lind, Rolen for 3-4-5 and then Rios in 6, but in true fact, Rios is trending at his worst season ever … so if he heats up and gets back to norm, you would want him in the top 4
based on that, I think that the line shuffle would probably be counterproductive over the 162 game season, IMHO
by aagoodfella on May 25, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
call snider back up
how about calling snider back up let him hit some ur 0-7 without him maybe call back cecil and send richmond down cecil had one bad start how many has richmond have
by jays rule on May 25, 2009 6:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Richmond was terrific yesterday....
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Starting pitching has been the only constant this year
Knocks on wood.
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can't call Snider up unless someone goes on the DL
or a few weeks have passed since he was sent down. It’s the anti-Taxi Squad rule. Plus he wasn’t hitting either, and he was in the lineup for the second loss.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 25, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Snider
snider is 2 for 7 (both singles), 2Ks, and a walk so far back in Vegas
by aagoodfella on May 25, 2009 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fire JP and hire this guy
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 25, 2009 6:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
he knows nothing of baseball
only jai alai
by aagoodfella on May 25, 2009 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Has Some Merit
The drunk thing probably has some merit. Sometimes, when the pressure builds without any relief, you just have to take a night off and blow some steam. These guys probably need it.
I think Joe Inglett’s ability to serve as a utility should be exploited. He can sub in for Scutaro, Hill, Wells and Rios, all of whom need a break.
The Jays are still getting hits, the big problem is that slugging is way down. How to improve extra-base hits appears to be the problem.
by aagoodfella on May 25, 2009 6:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
When they get back to down
take them all to Canada’s Wonderland… but no funnel cake!
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 25, 2009 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We better hope that Romero doesn't pitch like he did in the minors
Or we will be looking at a eight game losing streak…. :(
In the grand scheme of things, the pain of life is not worth it.
by adamgreuel on May 25, 2009 8:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Romero...
is the streak stopper…he just missed Arnsberg :)
by bunner on May 25, 2009 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I forget which one it was, but Cecil or Ray had terrible numbers in the minors before their call up and they did fine for the most part in their time up, so numbers in the minors don’t really reflect much. On the flip side, a guy might be doing fantastic in the minors and get called up and stink the joint out.
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rehab starts.....
I don’t care about the stats….they are trying pitches and getting back in shape. We’ll see tomorrow.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In my opinion, that day off after this series is going to be a huge break for the team, hopefully they can get refocused and come back and beat the socks off the Sox.
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 10:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I know Tom won't agree but........
many of you posted throughout this season thus far that the lineup did not make sense
at times, so now is the best time to change it. I know that Rios and Wells are supposed to the the best hitters on the team, and that is why they bat 3rd and 4th, but……why not take some pressure off them, at least for awhile. Here’s my lineup:
1) Scutaro 2) Overbay 3) Hill 4) Rolen 5) Lind 6) Wells 7) Rios 8) Barajas 9) Inglett
The best guys getting on base in front of your best hitter, with a veteran like Rolen taking over the 4 spot. Lowers pressure on Wells and Rios. Cito would never do it because he is still asleep in the dugout.
by Chesapeake Ron on May 25, 2009 10:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Why insult Cito?
I like Overbay second. I don’t like Rolen fourth, he hasn’t shown much power and he’s going to sit a bunch. Rios looked to be coming out of things this month, maybe he’s notthen no one is coming out of it this week.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
pitching rotation thoughts
The rotation is pretty solid right now (until Romero proves otherwise anyway) and over the long haul that does bode well for things coming around and the team remaining competitive. There was an earlier post about how Halladay missed Boston the first time in Boston, and NOW HE LIKELY MISSES BOSTON AGAIN at home this coming weekend – and of course the Jays face Wakefield again in game #1 to screw us up even further (if possible).
I read people’s earlier thoughts on not messing with the rotation, but for the Jays to face Boston again with 2 newish starters (Ray and Cecil the first time, Richmond and Janssen most likely this time unless they juggle things) and Tallet with no Halladay is terrible timing at best and lack of foresight at worst. Will they at least use Halladay on Sunday vs Boston on 3 days rest? Please? Or is that akin to changing the batting order, which apparently the manager does not see the value of……
by touchemalljoe on May 25, 2009 10:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
If you start Halladay on short rest now and say he hurts his arm...
for one start against the Sox in May….you are fired. don’t do short rest in may.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
just do like Gerry Dee suggested to him in an interview on the Score
just throw change-ups. =P
by jlahey on May 25, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why don't you pray for heavy rain on Wednesday in Baltimore,
pushing Doc Halladay’s start to Friday against Boston?
I’d rather give him long rest than short rest. We have enough fill-in arms waiting at AAA.
by PFHLai on May 25, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd rather it didn't rain and he have a great game on Wednesday....
don’t focus too much on one game against Boston….Is possible that he might not get the win anyway. Or that with the roof closed, Wakefield’s ball won’t dance and we get 10 off him.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You really want to mess with Halladay’s routine?
You mess with the rotation for matchups in August and September. Not May.
Now that doesn’t mean I don’t wish it lined up, Id love to see Halladay go against the Sox instead of the O’s but I wouldn’t go messing with his schedule to do it.
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
by JohnnyG on May 25, 2009 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably would be a waste of a start anyways
If the Jays are facing Wakefield and that screws up their bats even worse than they are now, Halladay will pitch a 1ER CG and lose 1-0.
With Tallet pitching solidly – a pair of 2-1 losses – and Janssen and Richmond pitching solidly, I don’t see harm in leaving them in. A pitcher can only take care of 1 side of the ballclub. Someone on offense has to smack everyone in the ass and get them going.
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
by wroth91 on May 25, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The thing about Wakefield is his knuckeball is completely unpredictable, he’s even admitted so himself. Meaning, simply because it was really good in the last game doesn’t necessarily mean its going to be as good in the upcoming game. At least I hope it isn’t, because that was one sad hitting performance…all those weak pop ups…scary.
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Last year we beat Wakefield 3-0 once and it was the first win of a 5 game streak
and later in the season he beat us 7-0 and we won the next game 8-1, and these are all the same guys, so I don’t think this streak is because of Wakefield. The last game of the Chicago series, we didn’t do much with the bats either.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sacrifice BJ Ryan to the Baseball Gods?
~K
"As the governor of Louisiana once said, the only way Chris Kelsay can lose his job is if he got caught in bed with a dead girl or a live boy."
by Kurupt on May 25, 2009 11:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Catalanotto
Would a guy like Catalanotto be useful? A veteran lefthanded bat with some pop, backs up both LF & 1B, won’t need a long contract and block Snider’s way next year, already familiar with T.O., …. too old? The Brewers just brought him back from AAA.
by PFHLai on May 25, 2009 11:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He could have been useful....
I’m not sure he’d be much better than Inglett but he could be. Actually the perfect type to fill in because doen’t cost you a thing to release him when you want to bring up Snider.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Inglett was Ofor in 3 games in Atlanta
Not sure if he was in game shape after his long layoff. Hopefully he picks things up soon.
by PFHLai on May 25, 2009 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
everybody was 0 for in Atlanta...
liked him last year but I’m pretty sure he won’t be that good two years in a row. That was a sad sad series.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, Catalanatto has sure declined since his years as a Jay if he’s toiling in the minors now. He had some pretty good seasons for Toronto.
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They called him up
so not toiling in the minors anymore.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm
Im starting to become afraid that the Jays arent as good as we thought they were.
We had a hot april against below average competition and thats about it. I think Linds hot start could be a mirage, Hill obviously wont be able to carry the team like he did earlier, and Scoots is playing well above his career averages…
Im starting to get worried that Rios will never become the player we all thought he would, and that Wells is just completely mentally out of it. I think Wells will improve a bit, but im not sure hes capable of carrying this offense…
The Jays corner infield spots arent that great. We’ve got Rolen, whos a good vet but just isnt the way he once was. i dont see him putting up better than a .280, 10-15HR, 70RBI season… Overbay just isnt that great. He had that one good season when we first got him but he hasnt been the same since…
Its looking more and more like a mirage to me… Im not trying to be terribly pessimistic im just calling it as it is… obviously i would rather think the jays will pull out of this slump and get going… but if they cant win 2 out of 3 against the sox im going to get worried.
by ohmybosh on May 25, 2009 11:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
oh heck...
A team is never as good as they look when they win and never as bad as they look when they lose…..Lind will even out somewhere between this year and last. Wells will balance out somewhere between this year and last. Rios will be like last year most years…..not as good as we would hope, but ok.
If Rolen does that he’s one of the top few 3B in the league, with his defense and I think he will. Overbay hits right-handers great, needs a good platoon partner. Scoot…with his defense if he keeps getting on at a .375 rate he’s as good as any SS in the division.
It will be fun the rest of the way…..if this slump ends at some point. It will.
by Tom Dakers on May 25, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here’s the thing, the Jays may have finished 4th last year but they were far from a bad team. They did finish 10 games above .500 after all. This year’s team is arguably better. And keep in mind that every team has a losing skid at some point in the season. Just before the Yankees won 9 games in a row, they had lost 5 in a row. And here’s a problem: you say that the Jays were playing below average competition during April. Thing is, many of the pitchers they have faced on this road trip have been pitching like crap for the most part this season, so you can’t say its because they’ve been facing stellar pitching. Keep in mind there’s a big difference between great pitching and bad hitting, and the Jays are more a victim of the latter than anything. As for Overbay, keep in mind that it wasn’t until he broke his hand that his numbers really started to decline. And its like Tom says, he’s great against righties. I don’t buy into this thing that I’ve seen several people say before about how the Jays only padded their wins against ‘bad teams’. The same could be said about the Yankees as well…7 of the 9 games they won were against Minnesota and Baltimore, after all…
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and I’ve really got to watch how many times I say ‘keep in mind’….haha
by Icedragon on May 25, 2009 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m getting afraid it’s as going to be as bad as I thought it was going to be. Hope not.
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you think these past 7 games are more indicative of the 2009 Blue Jays instead of the previous 41?
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
by JohnnyG on May 26, 2009 8:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not at all.
Really, people need to realize that EVERY team goes through a losing streak at some point during the season. If the Sox and Yankees go on a 7 or 8 game losing streak later on, are people going to be saying ‘hmm, maybe this is the real Yankees/Sox?’ I don’t think so. The Jays need to stop the bleeding and I think once they pull through this they will be all the stronger for it.
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have a question
See if you can remember who hit the last Jays homerun and who was it against and on what day?
Also, who hit the second last homerun?
To solve the problem, I would do what I suggested we do when we were winning and some of the guys were already in a slump, I would shuffle the lineup. We should have done that against the Red Sox. Now it probably doesn’t make a difference as everyone is bad. I like pulling the names out of a hat.
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Kevin Millar hit the last one off Wakefield.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is correct. He also hit the second last homerun. I had to go look it up after we couldn’t remember while watching the game. Went back many days before I found it unfortunately. So sad. Here I thought it was going to be a magical month again.
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, and the Rays blew a 10 run lead today
8 of it in the 9th.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 12:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh yeah....
I’ve been on Vernon enough. He seems to be a good candidate for lead off.
I would fire BJ Ryan. He is awful. I think the lesson from this, never sign a fireballer for 5 years.
How many fireballers are in the hall of fame? Take a guess. That’s guys who threw 100 mpH at some point in their career?
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Nolan Ryan, Walter Johnson.....
Koufax….Bob Feller….
BJ never threw that hard.
And never sign a closer for 5 year is a good plan.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The point is not many because they often get injured. There have been some good signings. Some of the worst free agent signings:
1)BJ Ryan (definitely a bad idea. I cringed when this signing occurred. Could not believe it actually)
2)Troy Glaus
3)AJ Burnett
4)Wells (I have to argue he’s been paid too much. Really hoping he proves me wrong)
5) Frank Thomas
I am sure there are others but not a lot of good free agent signings.
Good one’s:
1) Rolen (really like this guy when he’s healthy)
2) …
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rolen wasn't a free agent signing....
I don’t think AJ was so bad….Wells was bad, Thomas was awful. Glaus we got Rolen for so can’t complain too much. Ryan’s was bad.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
On a side note...
How’s this for a lauge (haha?). Atlanta lost 8-2 to San Francisco, a team coming into the series 3 games under .500….yet they could sweep the Jays? What does that go to show you?
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 12:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
We're in a slump?
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we answered Tom’s question. The problem is the hitting, not the pitching (except for BJ maybe).
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:22 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
solutions
obviously some things that should be tried won’t work…doesn’t mean they shouldnt be tried:
1) move wells to leadoff, adjust rest of lineup accordingly
2) give guys day(s) off
3) play inglett more
4) trade for Lefty hitter…yes it is hard to find someone out there…so i will throw out some names of guys—all of whom we can pick up for pitching prospects…some of which are cheaper than others…note that none of these guys are THE solution necessarily…they would help though…THE solution would have been picking up Ibanez over the winter as i had recommended last year…even picking up Dunn would have been smart, JP
that being said, here is a list of possibilities: (yes some of these guys may be injured and some are probably untouchable/untradeable by their teams)
Hermida
Brian Giles
Helton
Dunn
Berkman
Thome
Abreu
DeJesus
Adam Laroche
Go ahead —-dismiss them all…but most of the above names can be picked up for prospects
by norm depalma on May 26, 2009 12:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Ibanez is making $30 million over three years...we weren't going to compete with that
hermida is young, little power, Florida will keep him. Giles is making $9 million and is hitting .170, Helton is making $16.6 million and has a no trade. Dunn….less said the better. Berkman’s making $14.5 and has a no trade. Thome’s making $15.6 hitting .239 and wouldn’t come here. Abreu just signed with the Angels this summer, they are still waiting for his first homer. Dejesus is hitting .236 this summer, so might be able to get him, averages about 8 homers a year, not that season changer we were promised. LaRoche is batting .222, not sure what he is making, was $5 million last year. Might be able to get him, but we could have kept Snider up for less money.
So of them, likely could get Giles, not sure what we’d want with him, but they’d likely pay us to take him. LaRoche maybe the same. Could likely get Dejesus if we wanted him too….I don’t.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 1:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
peee - uuuuuu
that is a nasty list of candidates
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s funny. I was thinking last night we should have gotten Dunn. Definitely would be helpful.
Certainly an injection of offense from somewhere else would be very helpful. It’s been sorely needed and the fact we didn’t sign anyone this winter is coming into play now.
I was actually predicting this would be the worst year in a long time if the hitter’s didn’t hit because the pitching situation looked so bleak at the start. The starting pitching has been a big surprise and a nice one. The hitting has gone back to where it was last year. But we got a glimspe of what it can be with a little more seasoning.
I like the idea of a trade.
Trade BJ Ryan to a team that needs a wannabe closer and likes awfully big contracts. Ha! Right.
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Does no one remember this?
I love Adam Dunn and it would be great to have him on the team, but I think we can all agree it’s a long shot after that little event
by rabbit on May 26, 2009 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn ... OMG, are you kdding me?
look how folks bag all over Wells and Rios
and you want to bring a career sub-250 hitter here? this board would explode with folks complaining about Dunn
anyhow, there should be one simple trade rule … no trades for sub-250 hitters
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn for Mills and Ray. Done.
by BigTimeBlueJayFan on May 26, 2009 12:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Here’s a suggestion…we could just leave things as is and let the players work through it….
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 1:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
reply to tom dakers
Ibanez for 10 million a year—-roughly what we were ready to pay burnett…did JP even get into bidding for him?
hermida has 4 homers this year roughly on pace for his totals for last two seasons -he’s 25 so must have upside…true, florida prob considers him untouchable—-larouche prob needs a change of scenery, and giles either is finished, is suffering from petco field or some combo but is still worth a shot
Abreu is hitting 300 with OBP of 400 as usual for him…his homer totals will creep up to 15-20 by end of year as per his recent years
nothing wrong with taking a chance on larouche and giles
dejesus is worth a shot too
if we could trade for bautista last year, we could def take a chance on a couple of these guys if price is right…and that includes inquiring whether a player at tail end of career like helton is looking to come to a contender
the point is standing pat will get us 86 wins, a nice speech by JP and a toaster oven—-it would be criminal to once again waste the best pitching staff in baseball, the best fielders and some very good hitters and be satisfied with sitting out the playoffs///we are once again one good bat, or maybe 2 decent bats away from the playoffs
and re moving the lineup around—-the sabermaticians who say that random lineups do as well as carefully plotted ones err on many points—-the main one being the effect on the hitters——look at how david wright’s season turned around when he was put down to 5th this year for example…continuing to pencil in rios and wells at 3rd and 4th is the definition of insanity
by norm depalma on May 26, 2009 1:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Cross outs make it tough to read...
but you think Giles or Laroche is going to take us from 86 wins to 96?
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 2:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
dont know how or why cross outs happened actually
sorry about that—-
as for going from 86 to 96 wins…not sure if it would…it might/ it is worth a shot
as for cito caring less what i think—-what’s your point—-is this website intended to be a suggestion pile/direct conduit to cito?
by norm depalma on May 26, 2009 2:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
no you said...
rios and wells at 3rd and 4th is the definition of insanity
I don’t think Cito cares if you or I or anyone think he’s insane to do it.
Giles….Padres would give away if anyone would pay him….I’d bet no one will, I’m sure we wouldn’t. LaRoche….I have no idea, I’d keep Snider first but you never know. Neither is that impact bat that would transform the team.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 2:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, what is insane is the suggestion that Wells bat leadoff
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
While I'm happy with the leadoff job Scoots has done so far in 2009,....
and considering that Wells has been stealing bases successfully lately, and that his batting average with the bases empty and no one out is much, much higher, I wouldn’t mind having Wells in the leadoff spot to give Scoots a day off every now and then. It’s not so insane, is it?
by PFHLai on May 26, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
insanity
i realize Cito doesn’t care if i consider him insane…I wasn’t writing here to appeal to Cito…are you?
btw, here are some more possible players
Brad hawpe
Travis Hafner
Shin-soo choo
Russell Branyan
by norm depalma on May 26, 2009 2:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Just to address Choo, He is only on a 1 year contract at the moment, and there were rumours flying around that he wanted to return back to his home country to play (which I think a load of crap, but nonetheless). I would like to have Choo, but having him here blocks Snider, which I am not sure I want to do.
Hawpe would look great in our lineup. He has averaged 25HR and 95 RBI the past 3 years and his contract is even reasonable at 09:$5.5M, 10:$7.5M, 11:$10M club option ($0.5M buyout), but the problem there is where do you put him? You would either be taking at bats away from Lind or blocking Snider for the next 2 years (possibly 3)
Hafner while he has looked better this year (when he has played) is not someone I would be willing to trust as of yet, but I admit this may be a personal choice, and the indians might be willing to trade to get rid of his contract. But again the problem is blocking Lind/Snider. Hafner comes in and would have to play DH so Lind would move to left which would block Snider.
Branyan is looking great this year with the M’s. But with the laws of averages I can’t see him keeping up the pace. He hasn’t hit more then 20 Home Runs since 2002, and yes most of the years since then he has only had 130 to 240 AB’s each year the average has only every once cracked .250 in his career and that was 4 years ago.
It is a nice thought, and I would love to have someone else come in a cure the team, but I don’t want anyone blocking Snider so the only real spot is 1st base, and while there are a few power hitting LH 1B out there, I am not sure any one of them would be available for what we could offer.
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
by JohnnyG on May 26, 2009 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Choo is definitely worth talking about
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 8:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guess the question is 'how much are you willing to give up for a rent-a-player?
And would it match what Cleveland would want?
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nutin
No, you are right, Choo is not worth renting. But when he comes loose, he is worth talking to.
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess that's the question right now, you'd have to be pretty sure the player you are going for would put you in the race
if you are going to give up futures. Choo’s the first name that that’s come up that I’d seriously consider going for, but I can’t see the Indians wanting less then Cecil and someone. I wouldn’t trade Cecil for him.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed, especially considering a contract isn’t in place for future years.
Then I would have to look at his fielding ability, I know he plays Outfielder now, but could they convert him to 1st to avoid blocking Snider/Lind?
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
by JohnnyG on May 26, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess it depends...
If you are convinced he puts you over the top, do it easy. If not no. I’m not. He isn’t the impact bat that would bring us several wins. Your mileage may vary. The team went into the season thinking it wasn’t our year because of Marcum and McGowan hurt. Publicly stated it was a development year. I’m kind of against totally changing your mind on the team because of 45 games.
by Tom Dakers on May 26, 2009 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Branyan? Eek...
If there’s one thing you can be sure of with Branyan, its that he will strike out. A LOT. Do we really need someone who strikes out a lot? Isn’t Rios bad enough?
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haha
This is all funny to me. We don’t need anyone! We need our guys to get out of their mini slump. 3 weeks ago we were bragging that there was no outs in the lineup!
Happiness is a long walk with a putter in your hand.
by craig in calgary on May 26, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't Choo still have mandatory military service?
http://www.zimbio.com/Shin-Soo+Choo/articles/9/South+Korean+Military+Awaiting+Choo+Arrival
I don’t know if that’s changed or if he did get an exemption due to the WBC this year or not.
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
by wroth91 on May 26, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
HAH! That’s why the rumours were flying about.
I imagine the Indians could wrangle up some lawyers to keep him from being deported to serve though.
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. - Dogbert
by JohnnyG on May 26, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Someone on this next article mentioned he can simply become a US citizen and thus that would absolve him of the requirement.
http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ssf/2009/03/shinsoo_choo_waiting_for_word.html
I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it. ~Rogers Hornsby
by wroth91 on May 26, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is just having us getting drunk until the losing streak ends an option?
"The NY Mets are my favorite squadron" -- Apu Nahasapeemapetilon
by jessef on May 26, 2009 8:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Inglett
I think using Inglett to give players a break is key. Inglett should sub in for 2 consecutive games to give the following players a break:
Scutaro
Hill
Rios
Wells
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
2 consecutive days each, so that each player gets 2 straight days off, implying 8 days of play for inglett
by aagoodfella on May 26, 2009 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rios isn’t good enough at getting on base to lead off though. His OBP isn’t very good, and he doesn’t walk a lot.
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, I would leave Scoot at lead off, he’s done an excellent job of getting on base. Perhaps switch Rios and Hill? Hill so far as shown the most pop in his bat (he was really close to another HR yesterday) so moving him into one of the cleanup hitter spots wouldn’t be that bad of an idea would it? And its not like its that big of a shift either…just swapping the 2 and 3 guys around. OR if you want to go a bit further, put Hill to 4 and bump Wells up to 3.
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The fact that Hill has been the most consistent hitter, it makes more sense putting him into a position where there’s a chance with more runners on base. Wells seems to be a lot better at getting on base when there’s not the pressure of driving someone in, so bumping him up a spot or two seems logical.
by Icedragon on May 26, 2009 11:25 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
If you want Hill to have more runners on base
keep him in the 2 spot.
They're not just hitting home runs. They're doing the little things, like hitting doubles.
by Torgen on May 26, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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