The Sun Shines Through the Curtain Lace: 2011 Bluebird Banter End of Season Roundtable, Part I
by hugo on Oct 27, 2011 8:02 AM EDT
in Toronto Blue Jays Analysis
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PrintHi everyone. Well, the world series is still going, but we wanted to share some of our thoughts on the season past. Please continue the discussion in the comments, that's what makes the conversation "dangling" - also, it's a great Simon and Garfunkel song. Without further adeiu:
Tom: Favorite Beatles record? It changes from day to day. For a while I was listening to the early stuff, because I had dismissed it for years and was rediscovering how good it really was, but at the moment I’ve got the White Album playing on iTunes (RIP Steven Jobs). I know it is really 4 (or 3 and a half) solos albums, each guy only interested in his songs, but it is good music.
jessef: The Kinks Are the Village Green Preservation Society, though I truly love Arthur (or the Decline and Fall of the British Empire) . . . errr . . . since Hugo beat me to Revolver, I’ll go with Abbey Road. Though I’m really more of Kinks guy.
JohnnyG: Who are the Beatles? Kidding Kidding stop booing me now.
Johnny: Aaron Hill and Brett Cecil were the two biggest disappointments for me, Both were favourite Jays of mine going into the season. Everything looked good going into pre-season. We had a lot of hope that Hill would rebound and Cecil would build on his good season from last year. Then the games started and everything went to pot. Seriously. How bad was that? Cecil completely lost his fastball and then his location right after that because of the frustration. Hill seemed to actually regress at the plate much to the surprise of everyone. It was really depressing to watch.
As for surprises? I have to take a cop out answer and say the Front Office. We have been hearing Rasmus come up in trade speculation for awhile now and I was firmly under the belief that there was no way Cardinals would give him up for anything the Jays would offer, even if he was having a down year. Then low and behold AA pulls off a trade picking up the struggling Rasmus for what amounted to a handful of relievers, Patterson and one prospect in Stewart. I really was stunned.
Tom: I didn’t pick a pleasant surprise. Maybe the continued improvement of Ricky Romero. In his first 3 seasons he has had ERAs of 4.30, 3.73 and 2.92. Inning pitched goes up: 178, 210, 225. Hits per 9 innings goes down 9.7, 8.1, 7.0. Walks go down 4.0, 3.5, 3.2. Wouldn’t it be nice if every player had a nice progression like that?
Hugo: Like you, Tom, I was disappointed by the number of plate appearances given to also-rans and equally surprised by how long the Jays stuck with Jo-Jo Reyes while giving more promising players a much shorter leash. You already mentioned Snider, and I totally agree. I was also quite disappointed in Adam Lind’s season, but that’s another question.
In terms of pleasant surprises, it was great to see Colby Rasmus come to the Jays without a huge cost. I was shocked to see the Cardinals part with him so cheaply, but hey, it worked out for them this year. It wasn't quite a surprise to me because I've always thought highly of him, but I also really enjoyed seeing Casey Janssen light it up out of the bullpen.
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For a Beatles album, likely Revolver. Taxman and Elanor Rigby are to awesome songs to start an album with. As good as the Beatles are, The Who and The Doors are the best from that Era. :D Biggest dissapointment would probably be Snider and Drabek. I wasn’t expecting an All-Star year from either, but I thought they would both at least find consistency and secure a job in the Majors in 2012. What bothered me most is that they didnt seem to improve a whole lot in Vegas. I hope they both get a full year with the Jays at some point. As for biggest surprises, Bautista and the overall improvement of our farm system. I didnt think Bautista could put up better numbers than he did last season, I was content with 30HR and a .260 avg while drawing a good number of walks in 2011. He proved me wrong and now he is once again a leading MVP candidate. I was very pleased with that the farm took big steps forward this year. Lawrie was unbelievable in Vegas and for the Jays, Alvarez, Nestor Molina, Hutchison, & McGuire, along with many pitchers in the lower minors put up great seasons. D’Arnaud put up a monster season and Is likely our top prospect, Gose developed some power and showed off his wheels yet again. The Lansing outfield, I could go on and on… It was a great draft year too, I can’t wait until more of these guys start hitting the Majors.
by GoseBusters on Oct 27, 2011 9:10 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Got to admit, It's getting better
The J’s Playoff Prospects are getting a little better, all the time. Agree with Tom on Alvarez. He really softened the collapse of Drabek who never was overly dominant in his starts two seasons ago and therefore doesn’t make my disappointment slot… which goes to Cecil. He had me thinking he’d be a valuable 4/5 in our grand plans. Now he’s bullpen fodder/trade bait.
Dirty Mac – Rock ‘N Roll Circus (I was a die-hard Beatles fan from an early age, a rarity in my generation ’86, but I’ve mostly moved on to the Stones now) Can’t we all just get along?
But.. Rolling Stones – Exile on Main St.
Beatles – Abbey Road
But.. Rolling Stones – Exile on Main St.
Beatles – Abbey Road
No Pressure Kyle, We've Already Replaced You...
by JaysFanExiledinOTT on Oct 27, 2011 9:47 AM EDT reply actions
My thoughts
Sorry, I’m not much of a music man, and when I do, it’s the blues. So gimme some classic T-Bone Walker and I’m a happy man.
Pleasant surprises:
Bautista having an even better 2011 than 2010, when almost everyone expected some sort of decline (though differing in how much of a decline)
The redemption of EE
Romero using his fastball more and improving overall
Escobar bouncing back to become the SS he was before 2010
Lawrie!
Unpleasant surprises:
Farrell no knowing how to use his bullpen personnel early on (considering he was a pitching coach)
The amount of time given to retreads like Copa, Rivera, and Nix
The last minute position change for EE in spring training
The handling of the Escobar concussion
The inability of Snider to get his offensive game in gear
The predictably utterly futile waving at outside pitches by Rajai Davis
The potholed careers of Lind and Hill.
The really other good thing to end with is that Farrell seemed to have learned from his first half and applied it to his second half because the first 4 issues went away as the season progressed.
Beatles Album? I guess the “White”. I used to be their biggest fan 15 years ago, but soured on them a bit since then…
Pleasant surprises: Lawrie’s stint at the bigs, EE’s second half, Charlie V, Casey Janssen, and the Jedi, of course.
Dissapointments: Lind, Hill, Snider (I think there was a good reason to send him down. )
Sorry to see them leaving: Scrabble, Frasor.
"Words ought to be a little wild for they are the assaults of thought on the unthinking." (J.M Keynes)
I’m not a Beatles fan, I’ve always thought they were overrated. Yeah, I said it. If you want to discuss the best U2 album of all time, I’m in.
Pleasant surprises this year: Bautista hitting better than last year (did anyone expect that? I mean really expected him to have an MVP calibre season?), Lawrie dominating right from the start, the front office moves (Rasmus trade, Hill trade, the talent signed in the draft like Norris, signing Osuna as an IFA).
Biggest disappointment: Lind, I honestly thought he could hit better than that. I don’t know what to make of the guy anymore. He looked like a world beater in ‘09 and the beginning of this year, but then went incredibly cold. Maybe he was hurt, I hope that’s the case, but who knows? Also, I wanted to see Snider and Drabek break out this year, but they’re still young, there’s always next year for them.
Hic sunt fortuna dracones
I agree on Lind...
His last 1000 ABs have been oh so terrible, I have no faith in him as a hitter anymore.
.313/.400/.565
best U2 record?
it’s the Unforgettable Fire. Not particularly arguable.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
I thought Drabek was going to be very good
So that was obviously a big disappointment. I also thought Snider would have a breakout season. I was very disappointed with how his swing fell apart.
Lawrie’s breakout was a nice surprise, and so was Nestor Molina’s. Yes, he may not even have pitched in the majors yet, but he went from a nobody (low-A reliever) to very dominant starting pitcher as high up as Double-A
Dissapointments:
Handling of Snider
Adam Lind’s season
Carlos Perez’s season
Aaron Sanchez’s season
Pleasant Surprises:
The general success of the farm system
Excellent draft
COLBY RASMUS
If you don't like video game music, I don't think we can be friends.
by Pikachu on Oct 27, 2011 2:36 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
another pleasant surprise
the increase in activity on this site
If you don't like video game music, I don't think we can be friends.
Get off my lawn!
I think you'll find I'm universally recognised as a mature and responsible adult.
Twitter is the thing with all the tweets...
Disappointments:
- My biggest one, Travis Snider. What an absolute joke for the team to send him down in less than a month.
- Adam Lind — I truly thought he would bounce back. Maybe the injury affected him a lot but he was awful
- Kyle Drabek — It would be fine if he struggled a bit as a rookie which wouldn’t surprise many people but he was a disaster. The curveball completely disappeared.
- Patterson, Rivera, Nix — watching them play is brutal
- Brandon Morrow — I really thought he would take off and have a fantastic year. Still had great peripherals so maybe it wasn’t that disappointing.
- Brett Cecil — I still like him, a lot more than other Jays fans. Velocity was down and he was serving up meatballs. If he can get his velocity back up, he can be a solid pitcher for us
- Aaron Hill — but I was never really that high on him. Still I expected him to be much better than he was.
- Jon Rauch — why the hell was he our closer?
Surprises:
- JOSE BAUTISTA — He is a beast
- Ricky Romero — Love the way he is improving every year. Get some strikeouts + groundballs… love it!
- Brett Lawrie — Geez, does he know he is 21 years old? He was a monster this season (MILB and MLB). Defense and plate discipline really surprised me. I didn’t expect it to be that good
- Getting Colby Rasmus
- Alvarez — love the stuff
- McGowan — Seriously, I would have laughed at you if you told me McGowan was going to come back healthy and start
- Escobar — he was simply awesome
- Jansenn — reliable and consistent in the pen. Didn’t have much of that from the pen.
Favourite Beatles Album: Sgt. Peppers, but they’re all good. To me Rubber Soul might be their most important album, as that was the shift from extremely well done pop/rock and roll tunes to being the most inventive, imaginative band that opened the door to classic rock. Like Tom, I love the early stuff. The musicianship of what could have been simple three-chord rock and roll is amazing, something I believe McCartney deserves credit for. When other bands would have had repetitious three-note bass lines, McCartney’s were low-register counter-melodies. (The other bassist that impresses me this way is John Paul Jones.)
Obligatory White Album Joke: The White Album is the best single album of all time; the problem is that its a double album.
Bluejays Good Points:
Bautista having a great year and not regressing; the big worry was the 2010 was an anomoly.
Romero’s continued development
Henderson Alvarez: I hope it wasn’t a blip
Villanueva being an above-average starter
McGowan and Loewen returning to the majors
Casey Janssen: From getting the yo-yo treatment early to becoming the best option in the ‘pen
Litsch’s transition to the ‘pen
Rzep against lefties, Dotel against righties
Lind’s defense at 1B
EE setting down defensively and proving to be a valuable bat and an OK option at first, when needed.
Yunel Escobar establishing himself as one of the top SS in the game
Brett Lawrie- I can’t wait to see what he’ll do in a full season.
JPAs delevopment behind the plate, calling games and especially his hitting
Colby Rasmus’s defense – I love the call when Buck Martinez calls a line drive in the right-centre gap, which Rasmus tracks down.
Thames, with the bat and how hard he worked to improve his defense as the season went on.
Snyder was showing some really good defense and a great arm before being sent down.
McCoy being a useful utility/backup guy while setting an Airmiles record.
Base stealing (except when Bautista’s at the plate) – I love the speed game, when used effectively and appropriately.
Molina’s “speed”: 1 3B and 2 SB with only 1 CS!
The trades: Getting Rasmus and Johnson
The not-so-good to bad:
Lind’s failure to put it together at the plate
Sniders’ struggles at the plate
Hill – although based on what I’ve seen a read since the trade, I suspect Murphy’s approach was hurting Hill
The injury that delayed Lawrie’s call-up
Rivera/Copa/Davis – I really don’t want any of these guys using a roster spot or taking ABs from others, although maybe Davis as a pinch-runner, 5th outfielder would be okay.
Morrow’s inconsistency, but my belief, which I read elsewhere, was that with the defense behind him, he got into a mindset that he had to try to strike out everyone. I’m hoping that with decent defense, like he had in the last two months, he’ll develop into a dominant starter.
Drabek’s woes
The JoJo experiment
Litsch not returning to his 2008 form.
Dotel pitching to lefties
Losing Frasor, Rzep and Dotel in the trades – but I like what we got back.
The inability of anyone to step into the closer’s role, although FF looked like he was getting it together after the All-star break (ERA 1.37, 24 SO, 4 BB, in 26.1 innings)
Wakamatsu filling in for Farrell
Pitch-blocking: For pitchers to have confidence in their change-up, curve, etc., when runners are on, they have to have confidence that the catcher will handle the pitch.
General Baseball not goods:
The quality of umpires, particularly, when compu-umps are a real possibility. It seemed like the number of bad calls was even worse than last year and I’d love to see a study on the accuracy of ball/strike calls.
Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic
by bluejaysstatsgeek on Oct 27, 2011 4:33 PM EDT reply actions
Litsch had a 3.63 xFIP and 3.64 SIERA
and was also 0.7 WAR despite an inflated HR/FB. his ERA was a little up, but I’m more than happy with his numbers especially considering he was coming off injury
Agreed...
…I’d like to see him have a short at the rotation again next year, but if there are better options, he’ll contribute nicely in he ’pen.
Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic
by bluejaysstatsgeek on Oct 27, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I have to agree with Tom..
On the basis that the White album is my Favourite beatles album. while it has more of there soothing work it comes together well.
by Vancouverbluejay on Oct 29, 2011 8:29 PM EDT reply actions
