Rangers win Darvish Bid 51.7 Million
by JohnnyG on Dec 19, 2011 11:14 PM EST
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PrintHardly a monster bid as it was "reported".
Jays Lose. Commiserate in the comments.
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It is too bad the Blue Jays lost the bid for Japanese star pitcher Yu Darvish. This news created so much buzz in the city, which is quite remarkable for a baseball story on December 19.
I am disappointed, because it would’ve been quite fun to see Mr. Darvish in a Jays jersey next year. But oh well, I am sure the Jays bid an amount that they were comfortable with. I would be even more disappointed if this was turned into a PR disaster for the Jays.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
I know, but it really shouldn't be
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
I want it to be
Screw Rogers
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
...Because they did nothing wrong?
They submitted a bid. They lost.
Poop on the media for building the hype by reporting about reports about reports for 4 days.
If they are bidding
they might as well bid to win instead of bidding to lose. Otherwise, just do like the Red Sox did and not bid.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yea I guess.
AA said that he regretted not bidding enough to get Chapman, I doubt that he would choose to bid to lose.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
If the winning bid was >$60M
I would have been satisfied that the Jays tried. When they bid lower than Matsusaka got 5 years ago (for a better pitcher) they were pretty unlikely to win.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
Dice-K didn't work out
So bidding more than Dice-K is not necessarily a good thing just because he’s better. I trust AA to have established his number, and stuck to it.
Process first, results follow
Bid so it's good value.
I’m confident that’s what they did.
You saying AA knew he’d lose before he bid is, pardon my french, retarded.
.313/.400/.565
by T.Haynes on Dec 20, 2011 12:47 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
OK we just were talking below about not using the r-word.
Treat this as your warning.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:48 AM EST up reply actions
no worries
Just know our rules
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
How likely were they to win
with a bit <$50M?
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
What?
My point is you cant really say that, say, 49M (not that we know it was, but I’m working off you “anything under 50”) is unacceptable if the winning bid is 52
I know what you meant
but bidding <$50M isn’t an aggressive bid. Matsuzaka’s # was $51.1M so bidding just under that would be strange and likely to lose.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
51.7 hardly tops that, so I don’t see it. Add to this the fact that Boston was widely believed to have massively overbid, and I don’t think that reasoning makes sense.
Teams evaluate deals on a case-by-case basis. Bidding to win at all costs is a terrible way to run a business or a team. You set your projected value for the asset/player then bid accordingly, you don’t bid to win and then hope that it turns out to be a reasonable deal.
by Gerse on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
2006 dollars aren’t the same as 2011 dollars. The problem is a bid <$50M was unlikely to win. If they wanted Darvish they should have bid $55M+.
I didn’t say they should have bid to win at all costs just that they should have bid with a greater liklihood of winning or else made some comment in the media that they didn’t bid aggressively for him. What were the chance of them winning the bid with a bid <$50M?
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:48 PM EST up reply actions
Which is why the bid was similar to the Dice-K one. For that matter, 51.1 million in 2011 would have been 46,108,443.71 in 2006 – considering that the Sox (reportedly) outbid the 2nd place team by significantly more than that, your argument still doesn’t work. Dice-K’s posting fee is effectively nothing more than an arbitrary number in this discussion because the winning bid was so far beyond the second highest.
Well, it depends how low below 50M. 49.5 million clearly would have given them a good chance of winning. Treating 51.1 as some magical benchmark is silly. For that matter, you don’t have any idea whether the Jays bid 72 dollars or 51.65 million.
I don't think $49.5M would have given
then a good chance of winning. Some chance but not a good one. Is anyone surprised that the winning bid was greater than Dice-K’s?
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
Again
You don’t actually know how much they bid.
Dice-K’s fee is irrelevant to Darvish’s fee. As I just said, the fact that it was well known (or at least widely believed, which has the same effect) that the Sox massively overbid renders his posting fee useless as a guidepost.
What were the chances of them winning
with a bid <$50M. Maybe 20%?
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
It's a blind auction
You can’t really build a probability distribution since there is no objective data off which to base your assumptions (again, Dice-K’s was not a useful marker).
So, the probability of them winning with ANY bid, was
1/[number of teams that bid]
You can guess
For example:
What would the probability of us getting Fielder for 5 years/$100M be in a blind auction?
There exist polls that guess at the winning bid. That should give a relative probability. Not an exact one though. I thought the winning bid would be higher actually since so many teams are looking for pitching.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
Just because you want a player.
Doesn’t mean you bid whatever it takes to get them.
We also want Fielder. Let’s just offer him $240 million over 10 years so we can get him??
Business doesn’t work like that.
.313/.400/.565
Business
doesn’t work like that but winning does. It depends what the objective is.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:57 AM EST up reply actions
circularity
Gerse, you win. JaysSask, your argument seems to be: the Jays didn’t have the winning bid therefore they bid not to win. No one could have known beforehand what it would take, yet you argue otherwise. That’s not rational.
You can cite Dice-K all you want, but that was one example and it was a collosal failure. If anything, it shows that such large bids erase nearly all margin for error. That’s not good risk management, even for the richest teams in the game.
by terry the censor on Dec 20, 2011 1:10 AM EST up reply actions
That wasn't my argument at all
My argument is that they weren’t likely to win with the bid they made (if it was under $50M as reported).
They are more likely to win if they spend more money. It isn’t strictly necessary to spend more money to win, but there is some correlation between payroll and winning %.
They will however make more profit if they spend less money. Good business decision.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 1:15 AM EST up reply actions
Fail
This was a huge fail for the Jays. They had been tied to Yu since the beginning. To come up short was less-than-impressive. Yu represented a lot for Toronto. He represented a solid starter that could add legitimacy to the Blue Jays rotation. But more than that, Yu represented a change. He comes from an untapped culture in the Toronto market – a culture that would have driven sales and boosted the bottom line for the team (Rogers). I am disappointed. The Blue Jays missed out on a prominent opportunity.
Guess AA not as good at Texas Hold Em
Dan Szymborski thought it would take a 60M bid and that made sense to me given the Dice bid. I’m beginning to think that Jays read the market correctly on all the teams except for Texas; Darvish will wind up costing very close to what Cliff Lee got and up to 10M yr more than CJ Wilson so who would’ve thought Texas would only go all in on an unknown quantity.
Still, apparently Texas had someone watch each and every one of Darvish’s starts this year so I agree it was a total fail by Jays not to bid the 60…..even if it was 20 over the next highest.
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
Hm.
I am sure the Jays bid an amount that they were comfortable with
$5?
by Vogelscheuche on Dec 19, 2011 11:16 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Hey at least they now have the chance to pull the wool over our eyes yet again!
Will we actually bid on some one this year or is this the same as always and say well we’re going to work with what we have and open the cheque book next year. Disappointed! AA the the …..
by Olerud'sbat on Dec 20, 2011 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
This is what happens..
..when you trust a guy who voted Michael Young for MVP.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:16 PM EST reply actions
My heart hurts.
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
Boo this man
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
booo
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
See kids? This is why you title your pics
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Now we can truly stand back and see how crazy the internet hype machine can be
Ball.
by Casusby on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
After tonight, I'm all for SOPA. :P
joking, joking.
by Matt In Canada on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
Happy Trails to Yu...
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
good work!
something like this that everyone was waiting for, will most likely be posted on the front page regardless
You beat johnny though, thats like at least 500 internet points
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
This sucks so much.
Guess I really do get Jeff Mathis and that’s it to be excited over.
Awesome.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:18 PM EST reply actions
Dec. 19 is far away from training camp……. also Santos
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
also hyperbole?
hyperbole
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I only speak in hyperboles
You’re not really pointing anything out to me that I already don’t know.
Just let a fan be angry.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
I know.
I just, ugh.
So deflating. I thought this was in the bag.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
Understandable, I’m just going to assume Morrow and Cecil are going to become consisent next year.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I am so close to the edge of this team right now.
I want to believe. I want to trust in AA’s slow and methodical moves. But at the same time I can’t forget JP Ricciardi in an interview on Sportsnet from nearly ten years ago, saying all the same stuff, about upside and cheap talent.
And I just want to see anything to change my perception of how this team will be operated.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
This is just the emotional response. I’m fully aware I’ll have a way more thought out, logical reaction.
Sorry for being a bummer.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
I know AA likes his cone of silence policy
But I think it would really help if he comes out to say something.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
Never thought we would win when he was 1st posted (always thought it will the Rangers)
but then all the news and rumors just raised all my hopes. So really disappointed now.
I just hope we don’t overpay for another pitcher like Gio now
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
by noname3 on Dec 19, 2011 11:18 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Probably won't. Unless AA starts doing crazy trades.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
I just hope...
that this does not lead to the Jays overpaying the A’s for Gio. I don’t like the idea of signing Beltran. Might as well continue to keep the money locked up in the vault until an all star caliber FA who isn’t on the wrong side of 30 comes around.
I doubt Fielder’s demands go down to our level.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
I like Beltran,
but not Gio. Read what Rany J. wrote about him. He convinced me. Maybe I’m wrong.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
Whatever, Im glad we didnt get him, 100 Mil for unproven talent, Im sure AA will trade for a better SP like Garza or Gio.
This.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
If he's unproven. How do you know hes better or worse than Garza or Gio?
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
by outoforder87 on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
you dont
but at least you know what garza & geo are. Your not taking a 125m gamble on them
by TheMainEvent on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
You take the surefire #2 over the guy who could be anywhere from a #2-#4.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
we really don’t need this right now, Bruce, thanks
by leaflover4ever on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
Well, so 2012 is going to be a year still focused on building the core. It’s not awful, but Darvish would have been a big piece in contending next year.
with the improvements we made last year alone
we give ourself an opportunity to win 90+ wins this year. Thats playoff contention already. So I wouldn’t say we’re just focused on building the core
by TheMainEvent on Dec 19, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
We’d need monster years from everyone for 90+ wins. It’s not impossible, but it is unlikely at this point. Another solid starter is still a need for this rotation.
I think we answered a lot of questions last year..
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Certainly, but that doesn’t mean that we’re all the way there. The Jays will be better in 2012 without a doubt. And yes, there’s still a hope. But unless they add another solid starter and/or another strong bat in the lineup, we’re going to need to have a 10-12WAR improvement across our existing team. That’s a lot to add just through improved performances alone.
any of cecil/drabek/mcgowan is an upgrade over reyes who started most of last year
rasmus, johnson, lawrie are major upgrades over what we had most of last year. santos closing is an upgrade over what we had last year. how can you say having all that for a full year can’t easily equal out to 9+ more wins. not to mention what we could still do in this offseason to upgrade the team.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
Agreed
we have a much better team now. It just feels like, at least to me, that Darvish would have put us over the top.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
i think he would've for sure put us in playoff contention
but as AA has said, he doesn’t want to throw money just to get into playoff contention, he wants to do it to get sustained success, like when we are true contenders.
which is the smart way to run a business, instead of just throwing money at a problem & HOPING it works out
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:16 AM EST up reply actions
It could be a good business decision
and Rogers will probably make more money using prospects and cheap players.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:59 AM EST up reply actions
how can you say having all that for a full year can’t easily equal out to 9+ more wins.
Easy. Because 9 wins is a lot. And if you consider the Pythagorean, it’s actually more like 11 wins to hit 90. And the premise is based on what the team is right now. If they upgrade the rotation and add a bat, those are immediate improvements.
So let’s take a look. We need Rasmus to play to his potential and not his last two years. We need either Snider or Thames to effectively establish themselves as an everyday LF. We need Lind and Johnson to bounce back from bad seasons. We need Lawrie to continue to play to the level of his brief audition. We need the starting rotation to a) stay healthy, b) have a strong year from Morrow, c) an excellent rookie season from Alverez, and d) McGpwen or Cecil or Drebak to establish themselves as effective starters. Put all that together, and you have a 90+ win team with our current roster. That’s an awful lot of ifs.
Exactly
That was pretty much the problem with the JP era teams. Too many ifs and “career” seasons were required. Odds were really against that.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
but if we blew no saves that would be 9+ wins!!!
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
Rasmus doesn't need to play like 2010 actually
2011 Jays CFs (Patterson, Mastro, Wise, Loewen, Davis, Rasmus) were -0.8 WAR. 2011 Rasmus (0.8 WAR) is a win and a half bonus right there. I think 90 wins with the current squad is unlikely – agreed there – but I do think this squad is a true talent 85-win (or so) group
To make the playoffs
you don’t have to have everything go right or have good/great players at every position. Just look at the Rays lineup.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
No, but you need to have enough guys having big seasons to carry the lesser players. And you need to be realistic about your competition. I don’t think the Jays are far off. If they add a solid power bat and a legitimate front of the rotation starter, I think that they’re in the mix in the East. But without that, you’re stuck with a team that is good, but likely not quite good enough yet.
And there’s nothing wrong with that. I assume that AA will continue to add talent, let the pitching continue to get better as it matures, and be potentially there next off season. But as of right now, this team makes the playoffs through luck – everyone healthy, everyone playing to their potential.
i think this is better for us then a lot of people may think
i know we all got excited, and media tore our hearts away. but still, it just doesn’t seem like smart money. 125m for 5 years. darvish would have to come over and be a TOP 5 PITCHER in the majors, a guy we’ve never seen pitch in the majors. So I’m not overly disappointed, i think thats insane expectations of a player. What rookie have you seen come into the majors expected to be a top 5 pitcher in the game? not the best prospect in the history of the game could be expected to do that, and darvish is getting paid with those expectations.
Have to say I agree with this.
I wanted the jays to win the bid as much as anyone, but in retrospect I think it was all a little romantacized. International free agent in diverse T.O. community, us starving jays fans ate it up. The fact of the matter is he is very much unproven and to pay that much money for a potential flop is too risky. I can sleep now
Lots of dudes in the south wear Jays hats. I yell "Go Jays". They respond. "Canada has baseball?"
by jay_fan_inda_swamp on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is our payroll
is around $50M and going nowhere. Rogers profit margins don’t interest me that much.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
No idea but Rogers makes money off of Jays TV too. If they really believe in the market they shouldn’t have to operate like Tampa.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
i can't blame any owner, regardless if i have billions of dollars for managing money properly
if they aren’t making a proper income to support a higher payroll then i can’t blame them. and we have the right gm & farm system & gameplan to build the team up, build our attendance up, and thus build our payroll up. all in due time.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:14 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
The attendance has dropped because the payroll has dropped. If the Jays spent enough to field a competitive team attendance would be good, and Beeston has admitted this.
For all those defending Rogers not spending money what are we going to do when all these young players come up as free agents? Let them go like they let Delgado go? Trade them for more prospects like Halladay?
Nobody is suggesting the Jays spend at the level of the Yankees and Red Sox but spending at league average is not too much to ask.
My rambling tweets
Winning is a habit. Unfortunately, so is losing - Vince Lombardi
thats not true
the payroll has dropped & we’ve increased attendance the last 2 years lol. Building a winner is what brings attendance, regardless of what the payroll is. And using the payroll properly will help build a winner.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
who said we wouldn't re-sign holliday?
holliday wanted to be traded to a contender, nobody said we wanted to trade him. What player have you seen come up through the organization walk? we’ve signed every homegrown talent i can think of.
And what are we going to do with the prospects? Did you see Molina traded for Santos. Thats an example of one thing we can do, they don’t all have to make it to our big league club, we can turn prospects into great major league talent, with good contracts, via trade.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:27 AM EST up reply actions
typos are ok for me
but when it means you refer to 2 different people, its not cool man
His name is halladay!!!!!!!!!!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
Let's package Hutchinson and Snydergaard for him
by Gerse on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
pretty sure they lose money
or at the very least, don’t make very much
Maybe on the books.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:21 AM EST up reply actions
How much do they receive in television revenue from Rogers?
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:21 AM EST up reply actions
They don’t count TV revenue which makes sense from the Jays perspective but doesn’t make sense from an ownership perspective in terms of spending $
My rambling tweets
Winning is a habit. Unfortunately, so is losing - Vince Lombardi
Jays made a big mistake.
Fielder better be coming or this will be ugly from a PR stand point. Rogers has the deepest pockets in the league and the Jays need pitching. Terrible decision.
After not matching Reds for Latos, I'd say their PR is already doomed
Latos cost spare parts and prospects, Darvish costs just money.
To borrow from TaoOfStieb, “No rebound skanks” to Fielder or Gio!
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
Disagree
Unless I’m confusing your definition of spare parts. Many baseball writers believed the Reds gave up a considerable haul. I’m glad AA did not match that. To me, this is good PR: We have a smart general manager. I’d rather AA find a deal that he believes in (like the many he has made) than try to match another team’s offer just because a player is being shopped.
by EthanDR on Dec 20, 2011 2:07 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yes, a vast majority feel SD did better
I might be overvaluing Latos and undervaluing the Jays prospects but I feel like D’Arnaud and Gose would have been topped the Reds offer. To me those are spare parts that I would trade for a cost controlled, potential ace in Latos.
As for the PR, I was impressed when AA held the line on Beede so I get what you’re saying about finding the “right deal”. Not getting Darvish though makes two missed opportunities to improve on Morrow as the 2nd starter and pushes the window to compete further out.
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
Latos has a lot of value
But it is only a missed opportunity if you feel like the Blue Jays should have gone above and beyond what the Reds offered, and I don’t. As for Darvish, I would have loved the team to have won the bid, but we might not ever know how seriously the team considered it. In that sense, you could say that every player in the league that the Jays don’t get, is a missed opportunity, or we can just analyze the transactions they do make.
Whoever that last caller on FAN590 was...
I completely agree with him. I trust AA in whatever it is that he bid. Good luck to Yu Darvish.
by Adrian O on Dec 19, 2011 11:19 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Wish him a high ERA and a low xFIP.
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
What if he wanted to bid higher and ROgers said no?
This is the problem we’re looking at
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 19, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
that’s a pretty big assumption
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
that's very very unlikely
in purely baseball terms, bidding $50 million for darvish is ridiculously high already.
the only way the jays would have bid near that high is if ownership told them that he was worth $X extra dollars in revenue for them which they should feel free to add to their bid.
looks like we'll spend 2012 grooming our young players for a playoff run in 2013
where have I heard this before?
three years ago
since its always been the plan
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Getting Darvish was never a guarantee
it’s not like we offered him a crappy contract that he was obviously gonna reject, we bid and we didn’t win. Not sure why everyone is suddenly turning on AA when he’s proven time and time again that he’s a very smart GM.
Chill folks.
My heart hurts
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
This is why I try not to get hopes up. I usually don’t, but this time I did and BAM CRUSHED
by leaflover4ever on Dec 19, 2011 11:21 PM EST reply actions
the life of a fan
its a wonderful thing
sometimes
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
"It's cool to be a player but it sucks to be the fan."
-Marshall Mathers
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
lol i tried not too but everyone was reporting we won, its hard not to get the hopes up
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
Haven't been this disappointed in a long time..
Blah.
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
by outoforder87 on Dec 19, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
No don't
You have so much to live for. :(
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
I know
I’m baking a pie
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Nice!
What kind of pie?
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
pecan
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
You are a true hero.
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
Felix Pie?
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I like it when...
….I have no expectations.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST reply actions
I demand all the sources that started all the rumors to be expose
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
would be hilarious if AA came on and said that he knew that if the bid was 50+ they didn't have a shot at him
and all that media speculation was just that, speculation
It's not the end of the world.
I’m very disappointed, but it’s just one pitcher. Who knows what Yu can do.
The Jays have a good (but not contending) team. The rotation will fill out with guys from the farm.
Texas is in a win now mode. The Jays aren’t.
I like how the Jays were in it. Too bad the result wasn’t what any of us wanted unless you’re at LSB.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Will the Jays's bid be revealed?
Has it been already?
Am I the only one flagging this guy?
Seriously, do we have to wait for the money shot or a "F*** THE SOXXXXXX!" before we ban him? Doubleteapot… BAN HIM!!
by AlohaSox on Sep 28, 2011 10:20 PM CDT
by SandalsNoPants on Dec 19, 2011 11:23 PM EST reply actions
Exactly..
..I’m okay with them not going that high but I want to see that they bid something reasonable, like 35-45M.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
that was never going to win it
if they were serious 50 was the starting point….everything else was just playing around
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
Today was the 1st day I seriously heard the Rangers were involved.
The whole time it was Jays, Jays, Jays. I’m guessing it must’ve been about $50 million.
Am I the only one flagging this guy?
Seriously, do we have to wait for the money shot or a "F*** THE SOXXXXXX!" before we ban him? Doubleteapot… BAN HIM!!
by AlohaSox on Sep 28, 2011 10:20 PM CDT
by SandalsNoPants on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
The Blue Jays are involved in all the rumours.
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
Jays tanked the bid
Pretenders, not contenders.
I’m bitter, because the winning bid was entirely predictable.
If anyone disagrees, save it. Save it for someone who cares.
oo we got a jumper
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, off the Rogers bandwagon.
Ouch it hurt too.
by Fred Draper on Dec 19, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions
I'd jump but,
the beer tastes too good.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Jays tanked the bid ’cause they bid $15 million right? From your source?
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
It seems like you care.
A lot.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions
So whats the new banner going to be?
Missing Yu?
Yu Broke My Heart?
Yu made me want to kick a puppy?
Nevermind we'll find someone like Yuuu
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
that last one
will work great for a few days, love it
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
Yu Saved Me $100 Million To Spend More Wisely
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
oh i guess thats pretty darn good
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
You know..people have been telling me that Telus has better coverage where I'm at anyway.
by ABsteve on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Fielder
Now we can focus on The Prince go get him AA
by Corey Aglukkaq on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST reply actions
This.
He would go loco in Toronto.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
Not happening.
We got Mathis. He’s like Fielder, if Fielder had no arms.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Pretty much.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
this is so strange
but so bloody funny
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Rizzo is gonna be dealt for a starter.
He’s going to Chicago or Oakland.
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:29 PM EST up reply actions
*either CHicago team
Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.
by Frederick0220 on Dec 19, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
Now people are gonna list the reasons why it's good we lost.
Ugh
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
Ya... fans are too emotional
I’m sad that we didn’t get him but o well :(
Yeah I hate that.
It’s okay to be disappointed. But I hate how people try to cover up their disappointment by trashing darvish, the team, the gm – the same ppl they were gonna praise – had we won the thing.
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
by outoforder87 on Dec 19, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Like oh 50mil is a lot of money.
Shut up fools
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
i hope we aren't telling people to shut up
lets be civil!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Not here bud
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
More fairweather fans
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
knew there was going to be all kinds of comments tonight
just don’t try and pick fights!!
I know it will be hard, its not worth it
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
I took a breather
I meant Jays fans will be like “Oh 50 mil is too much”, he’s “unproven”. When they were dreaming about him an hour ago.
A day that will live in infamy: August 4th, 2011, Sept. 28, 2011 wasn't bad either.
"Someone like Yuuuuu"
not much correlation there
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Yankees owners are cheap, they didn't bid $60 million on Darvish
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:28 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
this guy
he gets it
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Their payroll is already $190M+ and they are trying to get below the tax threshold.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:29 PM EST up reply actions
Bids don't count towards luxury tax
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
but darvish's salary is going to be WAY under his market value
i’m actually shocked that the yankees didn’t win the bidding. makes way too much sense given the luxury tax implications.
Once burned, twice shy?
I mean fundamentally, if your evaluation of the player isn’t that high, then even with those advantages, it doesn’t make sense.
It will still be $10-15M/year
that they don’t want to add. Also, they have had problems with Japanese players in the past.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
True
but their only point of comparison is their position and nationality.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
bummer
When I heard we were in on Latos I started to have my doubts that AA made a bid that he thought would win. Before that I thought we’d go to 55 and be the highest bidder
I hope Nolan Ryan...
gets into a fight with his non-english speaking employee and gives him a Ventura.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:29 PM EST reply actions
lol ultimate trolling, seriously he still got good minor league info but
Kevin Gray
Sorry. Got bad info from trusted Blue Jays sources, who are just as upset as you guys. First time I’ve been burned in 17 years.
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
Trolled by Bud?
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
lmfao
FIGHT TO THE DEATH
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
Not interested in crapping on a guy in his predicament.
Doesn’t help my health.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
I honestly thought he had been hacked
At first at least. Major knoc on his credibility, especially for non-first hand reporting of FIsher Cat news.
I hope the bid we made is recealed
because if it’s anything less than 50 mill…..it’ll be shown that we weren’t all that serious…we’ve been speculatng for months that it would take above 50 to get him so you have to figure if the Jays want’ed to get him, they’d have to bid more than that
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
no
but it does no good for AA to have the public believe he did if he didn’t
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
The Farrell situation caused a policy change
I wonder if this will too.
Exactly.
Like the commercial about the white race car:
Joe blow: How much does it cost?
Dealer: $125,000
Joe: (gulp) yeah, but does it come in blue?
by Fred Draper on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
And if the next highest bids was $35M, and we bid $50M, the complaint would be they were stupid to bid that.
The bid should be based on the evaluation of the player. End of story. Process first.
Not many people would have said that because it is a blind auction.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
exactly
it was a blind auction! why is anybody upset with the jays for not bidding enough? this is absolutely crazy. they clearly bid the amount that they thought was best for the team. do people no longer believe that the front office knows what it’s doing?
People are disappointed because they didn’t bid aggressively.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:32 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I know that
because an aggressive bid would have won.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:37 AM EST up reply actions
an aggressive bid would’ve won us pujols too. are you disappointed that we didn’t offer him $300+ million?
people should only be disappointed
if the team didn’t bid the amount they thought was best.
what would be disappointing is if the team bid aggressively but they didn’t think he was worth it.
I hate the internet.
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
I don't understand why people can get so irrationally angry about sports
I’m actually happy for them, maybe means that they don’t have more important things to be unhappy about.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
How can you close a blind auction?
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
At this point
Wouldn’t it be better to just let our prospects develop then trade the farm away for a mediocre SP.
by bkradz on Dec 19, 2011 11:31 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
yes
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i like that logic
and i hope its the general consensus
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
That's what I've been saying all along but for some reason some folks really want to blow up
the mlb roster and farm for Votto
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm pretty sure that AA won't break the bank for any of them
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
What's the success rate of prospects?
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
Even if its >10%
the jays got so many that we’re bound to fill out a starting rotation
Follow me on Twitter at @AlexDavidson68
Yeeeuuuuuuuuuuppppppppp!
Do you have a young, talented cost controlled player having a down year who's "attitude" has cased problems with an aging player or manager?
Don't worry, I Alex Anthopoulos will take him off your hands, I'll even give you some moderately useful veterans that will "help you make a playoff run".
by jaysfan100 on Dec 19, 2011 11:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
STORAGE WARS
you’ve got outbid by…………..Brandi hahahahahaha
Now I'm in the mood to cry..
..if we had Halladay how would we do this season? #helpmecry
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:33 PM EST reply actions
and what if i married
elisha cuthbert hmmm (you are welcome for the fun thoughts)
either one wouldn’t have happened
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
Disapointing
wasted time on the computer waiting to hear that the jays have signed him, could have been watching the oilers game now i’ll just have to watch the 3rd.
by Corey Aglukkaq on Dec 19, 2011 11:34 PM EST reply actions
Just a general warning guys
Bowling Guy and I have our banhammers fully charged and ready to go. Please keep civil, control your emotions on here, and avoid personal attacks. If you need to cool off step away from your keyboard, put on a jacket and jog around the block.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:34 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
*glares*
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:36 PM EST up reply actions
no i was laughing at the last sentence
not you guys POWER
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
Heh I was serious
I jog outside when I need to cool down.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:38 PM EST up reply actions
i get tired just thinking about jogging
or outside for that matter
Where are my cheese doodles
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
Yu Go Jog.
Sounds like a pitcher we’ll win the bid for in 2019
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:36 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
you are on fire
greeen
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
Damn it
Skipped work for hours of speculation and massive disappointment. I better call in sick tomorrow.
That was my plan..
but my best friend is my boss. FML
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
I bet the Jay's bid was around $25M
too bad we’ll never know
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST reply actions
I don’t want to know. Nothing good can come from knowing.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 19, 2011 11:36 PM EST up reply actions
yeah i don't care to know either
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
I actually think the 48 mil rumored sounds about right
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
I think it was $10M
(I got that by flipping a coin betwen $10M and $40M, because I don’t have any more accurate source of info, and neither do you)
All I want to add
Is I hope Nomura and Darvish, if he ends up signing, ends up sucking every last dime out of Texas
I feel like AA just told me I would be going on an awesome camping trip.
And then left me sitting on my front step in anticipation. This sucks.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:37 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Come on, you're old enough to understand this by now - I'm nailing this broad!
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
That would definitely cheer me up
Some Arrested Development (Thank you for getting my reference!)
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
Did AA tell you that, or did all your friends tell you that AA would take you on an awesome camping trip
even though they were just making it up?
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I still love The Silent Assassin
AA forever
Jose Bautista has a higher midi-chlorian count than you do.
by Jays11 on Dec 19, 2011 11:38 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
I'd love him too..
…if my first wife was JP.
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
ALL OF THE EXPLETIVES I'VE EVER YELLED IN 5 SECONDS
…and i’m back on the Prince Fielder train.
by BrownMagician on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Did AA have Rogers invest..
…in Greek Bonds?
by Julius Seizure on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST reply actions
My friend called me pathetic and it’s very very hard not to yell at her.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 19, 2011 11:40 PM EST reply actions
there there.
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:40 PM EST up reply actions
I told her Sid will never play again (she loves him) and I feel a lot better now.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 19, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
thatta girl!!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
Leafer87 needs to take up baseball before she goes throwing around accusations. /PPP assumptions
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
by Redonred on Dec 19, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
gingersnowflake no?
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
yep! Now I’m flattered that you know that, haha :D
we actually had a legit fight about this. But we made up. :P
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
wouldn’t it be more girlish if we still weren’t talking? :P
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:25 AM EST up reply actions
it would be pretty hard for us to not talk though, since we run two blogs and the TeamUnit facebook page together
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:26 AM EST up reply actions
A guy would have thrown some punches then gotten each other a beer to make up
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
Trouble. Make some Jays posts during the summer, see how that turns out.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I will. I put up with letters to Sidney Crosby, she can put up with some baseball
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
excellent. More reading more better or something
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Okay, next step
Time to start preparing for Jorge Soler and/or Yoenis Cespedes. Life moves on.
I know Jays Sask is with me here
by MjwW on Dec 19, 2011 11:42 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Soler Power!
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
Yes for sure
I removed the text though, it didn’t work for Darvish—time to try a different method.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
It must be nice to be in a sports town
where you know you’re team will pull out all the stops to win. That and be a place that Free Agents would like to come to.
I’m done getting my hopes up for players. Back to simply watching the games and being entertained.
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
You mean like Toronto in the early 1990s?
After they have build the foundation from respectable to perenial contenders for almost a decade from 1983 onwards
I want to believe you.
I wish I had witnessed that first hand. I just have these stories of how a team went from a team with a lot of heart that was short on talent to a powerhouse franchise with back-to-back titles.
Instead, my time with the Jays has seen a complete destruction of said powerhouse, a GM who promised a five year plan that is nearing a decade long plan, and a new GM who is asking fans to pin their hopes on high risk prospects and behavioural problem young talent who are the ultimate personification of boom or bust.
It hasn’t been easy times. But I’ll hold onto your optimism. Because you were there.
I hope I get to see it too.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:48 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't, personally
I nly got into baseball around 1997-98. But I’ve read to know what the process looked like. Toom Cheek wrote a good book chronicling it, “Road to Glory”
I'll need to pick it up.
I need some optimism. And you seem to have it in spades my friend.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:53 PM EST up reply actions
Have to.
I was upset when the Jays lost the bidding for Goose Gossage in 84.
I watched the Jays lose the ALCS in 85 after up 3 games to 1.
I cried when the Jays lost 7 in a row to the Tigers in 87 after being up 3 1/2 games.
I sat with rage as Rickey Henderson destroy the Jays in the 89 ALCS.
I was pissed off when the Jays couldn’t catch the BoSox in 1990.
I was stunned when the Twins destroyed the Jays in the 91 ALCS.
Then there was the Gord Ash years…
And JP
Losing Yu in a blind bid. Meh.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
Haha at least you've got two glorious years.
My experience begins at your second last point. You can see why this hurts a tad.
In the grand scheme of things, it’s meh. But right now, it’s BLARGH
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
I liked where AA is going
I’m happy to see this group gel. I would have been as happy as anyone here if the Jays got Yu, but it wasn’t meant to be.
Just seeing for what it is. One player.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:02 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, I mean, if everyone progresses, it won't matter
But if Morrow and Cecil struggle mightily, and the Jays high upside guys slip, then we will be dangerously close to Padres territory.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
I dunno. I think the Jays will be better
We saw a lot of positives in 2011. It’s going to be a bumpy ride to become contenders (and/or WS champs) as I outlined in my own experiences with this team.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I'm still going to be excited.
I am really curious about Rasmus. And KJ. And I’m super stoked for Lawrie (can you be anything less? I feel like he demands “super stoked”).
And Jeff Mathis double he’ll hit this season. That’ll be awesome.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
We enjoy what we have not might have been.
I understand why people are mad. If this had happened when I was 16 then I would have gone all insane in the membrane too.
Without Yu, I’m still looking forward to the 2012 Jays
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe wild pitch strike three advance and then an advance on error?
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
Gotta say, It would be awesome to claim that you were at teh game were Mathis hit his only extra base hit of the season. Bonus points if he was on the other team.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Like not liked
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
It will be annoying
if we trade a bunch of prospects for starting pitching now.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:05 AM EST up reply actions
I;m actually a pretty big pessimist
I’d call it realistic, but most would call be pessimistic. And I guess that’s the reason why I think it’s okay…I didn;t think there was more than about a 25-30% we would get him. Texas made a lot of sense, they’re a similar team to us process wise except ahead of the curve in terms of they are competitive now.
I always figured AA would put a value, and that would be the bid. And that type of rational thinking is not conducive to winning an auction, particularly a blind one
yeah just like that
that magical time 20 years ago
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
keep in mind we built those teams
and then bought a championship Yankee style
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
we were also the highest payroll in baseball
we paid them to come here
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
Arguably the Jays are a winning team as presently constructed are they not?
I mean, over .500, really close to contention, and yet, there is no money.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:55 PM EST up reply actions
with the foundation we have
a cash infusion on talented players would put us in contention….as opposed ot the last time we tried that where he lacked a foundation
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
So why wait?
If the foundation is sound, why not spend some of the money?
I’m not trying to troll, I’m just so confused.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
we're arguing on the same side
I like to spend now too
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
We're not close as some people think. Yet
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
not to mention
the dynamics of baseball are a whole lot different than it was 20-30 years ago
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 19, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
Darvish is going to hate Texas
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST reply actions
No one probably wants to talk to Chan Ho Park....
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
Well, at least we have two million outfielders!
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST reply actions
Gose has a pretty good fastball, doesn't he?
"Captain Picard Day is for the children." : Captain Picard
"Wu-Tang is for the children." : ODB
I'd have to see his FIP stats, but sure.
If only sarcasm font worked in titles.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 19, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
Mid 90s, I read.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 19, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions
Okay, I'm good now...
FIELDER!?!
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
Damn, Canada
This was one more thing I was supposed to like about your country. Please sign Fielder now.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Dec 19, 2011 11:47 PM EST reply actions
Our number for Fielder
is certainly less than market value.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 19, 2011 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
we are very sorry!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 19, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
Did you know?
In a democracy, people who call JaysTalk and this Yu Darvish show get to choose their political leaders!
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
Isn't it scary?
Mind you, I’m enough of a political geek towatch CPAC call-in shows. If you think this is bad, you should listen to some of those cranks.
Don't worry, It'll be a well known rule
so people capable of logical thought – like self preservation – will already know to steer clear
Also I figured the happiness about replacing democracy with an oligarchy would outweigh negatives.
Worst case, you two can have cushy jobs.
I had saved this gif for when we got Darvish. But, since I needed a laugh. It's Ron Effin Swanson
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
So will that boycott Rogers petition raise it's head again now?
I want to sign now
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 19, 2011 11:52 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Announcement made 11:11 pm tonight, AA probably got pissed off at Rangers' win
You know who also got pissed off at 11:11? Kaiser Wilhelm.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
Yea I know. Was trying to say something smart :-(
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 19, 2011 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
Speaking of Kaiser
you know what I’m not putting on my Kaiser anymore? Ham that’s what!
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:01 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I commend AA for sticking to his plan
Not to say he didn’t make a (serious) pitch to acquire Yu, but he obviously set a value to the guy and let it play out.
I guarantee you he isn’t crying about it.
by Fuzzpuke on Dec 19, 2011 11:55 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
His value though is based on his budget. Bigger budget= ability to set a higher value.
My rambling tweets
Winning is a habit. Unfortunately, so is losing - Vince Lombardi
by furcifer on Dec 20, 2011 12:12 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
truly heart breaking... but..
I have been a fan of the Toronto Blue Jays since I came to Canada in 87’ and this has to be in my top 3 biggest disappointment as a fan. But it too will pass. Thank you guys for endless hours of entertainment and non stop refresh button and keeping as true fans of The Toronto Blue Jays updated and excited. But in the end we did not get our man but in AA i trust. Go Jays Go!
at first i was like top 3? really?
but then i tried to think of my top 3, and couldn’t think of any
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:01 AM EST up reply actions
My top 4 disappointments
For me:
1. Robbie Alomar announcing that he was leaving the Jays (I still remember when my dad told me. I think I cried.)
2. Roger Clemens leaving the Jays
3. Hearing that Tom Cheek lost his battle
4. Not hearing Jon Cerutti ever again
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:05 AM EST up reply actions
Speaking as an Old on this board.
1) 1987 Last 7 games
2) 1985 ALCS up 3 games to 1. Lost in 7.
3) Trading Roy Halladay
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:15 AM EST up reply actions
Halladay trade was the most pain I think I’ve felt in my 23 years. Losing results in anger in frustration that goes away, Seein Roy gone still sucks. Worse than seeing Kabby in a hab sweater.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
that hurt
but i wasn’t dissapointed….
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:20 AM EST up reply actions
1) 1994 strike
2) 1994 strike
3) 1985
4) 1987
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
oh wait
Mike Sirotka should be there somewhere.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
ok here we go
1) hill being traded
2) Not signing Vlad last year
3) Losing Carpenter
I guess? i’m too young…
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:25 AM EST up reply actions
At least this is kinda fun…. sort of
Wilnerness590 Mike Wilner
The Rangers were the high bid. @2KyleB: @Wilnerness590 How likely is it that the Jays bid was higher than the Rangers?
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
bwahahahah
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:02 AM EST up reply actions
hahah
i hate people
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
by outoforder87 on Dec 20, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
CONSPIRACY!!!!
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
lol i saw that too, i was what is this guy talking
the guy probably don’t know about the process
Toronto Sports Fan= Waiting, waiting, waiting.............then more waiting
fml fml fml fml
! i.imgur.com/lLTKU.jpg!
by ddbumpus on Dec 20, 2011 12:04 AM EST via mobile reply actions
let's try this again....oh and fml.
!i.imgur.com/lLTKU.jpg
by ddbumpus on Dec 20, 2011 12:05 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
theres a img button in the menu
the last one, use that
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I'm on mobile.....
I failed to get yu my photo.
see what I did there with yu?
by ddbumpus on Dec 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
here ya go
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
aMikeRophone Mike Rophone
Jays didn’t get #Darvish. How bout bringing @deckmcguire up instead? @Wilnerness590 @ShiDavidi
15 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply
Retweeted by deckmcguire
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
by Redonred on Dec 20, 2011 12:05 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
JP(R)A
jparencibia9 jp arencibia
Think about it fans… 50 mill posting fee, plus what he gets in contract… Could be paying someone 150 mill who’s not proven in MLB!
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
by Redonred on Dec 20, 2011 12:06 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
meh maybe, in the long run they must be loving what he is doing, big leader in the Teamunit thing. But hard to find a line on twitter. Probablly fine as long as he doesn`t start attacking peoples.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
The Yu drama probably annoyed a lot of guys who busted their humps in the minors
Seeing some guy get showered with, er, money and never had one day of MLB experience.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
he's right
I mean we could always throw 150 mill at Vernon Wells again
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
how about we trade jpa
for a pitcher.
by ddbumpus on Dec 20, 2011 12:11 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I am disapoint
Night night
thisrighthere!
by TonyFernandezSavedMyLife on Dec 20, 2011 12:08 AM EST reply actions
Anyone have a ’Son, I am dissapoint" pic to post. Love those.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
night
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
RGriffinStar Richard Griffin
Jays need to use money saved on Darvish to go after starter like Gonzalez, Danks, Shields or Garza; sign vet hitter short term like Beltran.
Soo how much cash would we have to send to trade for Garza without decent prospects? 51.75mil?
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
not serious^
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I swear he's a Jays Talk Caller
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:16 AM EST up reply actions
i love this logic
oh toronto reporters, never dissapoint
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:16 AM EST up reply actions
Grif
always thinking he is.
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:17 AM EST up reply actions
"Money saved on Darvish"
Funny, I didn’t realize we were paying him anything that just came off the books
I wonder if he's
aware of the contractual agreements between the players he mentioned and their respective teams.
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
This is why there are a lot of people in debt
“Hey that $1999 big-screen TV is too expensive for me.”
“Whoa I just saved $1999! Imma gonna spend it on this new set of golf clubs!”
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:20 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
So the budget of the 2012 Jays will be under $55 million correct?
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:19 AM EST reply actions
seeing the bid just a touch over the Dice-K bid
stings extra. As far as the Jays go at this point, I will believe no more rumours that involve massive amounts of cash. Until the day it happens, end of story. Rogers and management should shut the bloody hell up about any future payroll numbers they can support. It honestly just makes me even more frustrated as a fan.
So basically AA is going to have re-create the Rays on a shoestring budget, hope for the fans to come back while he fields a contender on a 70-80 million dollar payroll in the AL East, and THEN Rogers cross my heart promises to spend the money? It’s possible, just not for another 3 seasons at least. When Bautista is likely declining. Being a Jays fan stinks. Wonder what the all-time record between meaningful games played is for a franchise? ’93 and counting…
Jumper #2!!
this really isn’t a sign that the jays aren’t willing to spend.
When they let young players walk because they don’t want to pay, thats when i will be upset.
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
seeing the bid just a touch over the Dice-K bid stings extra.
Because Dice-K was such a great investment?
It’s possible, just not for another 3 seasons at least. When Bautista is likely declining.
I don’t agree with the premise, but assuming it’s true, you realize that the stars that the core Jays teams of the mid-late 80s were built on didn’t really contribute to the WS teams (Steib, Bell, etc)
How many WS did Boston win with Dice-K
the end justifies the means….now if you said Lackey I’d be more inclined to agree with you
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
False logic
Thats only true if Dice-K was determinative to winning the WS. And without him, they could have spent money other other talent, or may have contributed just as much or more.
may or may not
like you said below hindsight is 20-20….they won and he contributed that’s history
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:27 AM EST up reply actions
And he still ended up as a terrible use of resources. Yankees won in 2009 with Burnett, is he worth his contract? What about A-rod’s 10/275M contract from 2007. Im sorry, that logic doesn;t hold water
what holds water is they have rings
we don’t know what the altenative course of action would have resulted in so we can’t speculate
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
I can’t say they would have won without him.
You can;t say they won because of him.
I can say say that on balance, the Red Sox paid too much for what he ended up contributing.
fine
but the goal is to win a championship….they made a move that they though would help thiem win a championship. They did. He contributed to that championship team whether you believe so or not. In the end isn’t that all that matters. Winning?
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
Yes that's the goal
But it’s a business, and there are finite resources. You have to use your finite resources as effectively as possible. Dice-K was not, in any objective sense, a good use of resources.
But they won a world series!
The Jays have been non-contenders for almost 20 years. A playoff appearance is so necessary. We need fans, but we need a thing to be excited about.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
You can honestly say with a straight face
That if the Blue Jays could win a world series and had to spend some extra money on somebody like that to guarantee the win, that you would be mad?
Really? Like, I know all this economics talk is logical, but as a fan, for the majority of the fan base who live and dies with on-field success versus financial responsibility success, you’d rather balance the books then win a World Series?
I realize there’s a whole lot of straw man going on in my post, but like, a World Series is a World Series. The goal is to win it at all costs. Is it not? When did sports change?
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:13 AM EST up reply actions
the best way to get good results is good process
someone else getting good results with bad process doesn’t make the bad process good.
and when a team is owned by a company with shareholders… it’s not quite clear whether the goal is to win. I’ve posited before that I think in the NBA the most profitable thing to do is to build a perennial 50-win, 2nd round exit playoff team a la Bryan Colangelo
by benk on Dec 20, 2011 1:15 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, and if that's the case then I'm sorry but I would have to jump ship
To a team with a guy (or girl) who owns the team individually and who wants to win. Like Mike Illitch, or the Nationals, etc.
Because, if at the end of all of this, Rogers goal is to build their franchise value and not to win, then there’s no sense in supporting that team.
If running a AAAA team is the goal, then as a fan, I can’t willingly spend money on a mediocre product that has no chance at getting better.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:18 AM EST up reply actions
I know, but I'm using the extreme for argument's sake
I mean, I see the on-field results. They’re making improvements.
But they have so many, “If he plays to his absolute highest potential then MAYBE they can be in contention for the wildcard” that that’s hardly something that will make fans come out to the games.
And now, with everyone (Twitter fans, etc) buying into Beeston’s stupid announcement that he could get $140 million if we needed it which has been grossly misinterpreted by everyone, and Darvish not coming to Toronto, this year’s attendance has massive potential to drop.
And then what? No money because, as fans, we didn’t do our job?
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:22 AM EST up reply actions
it's not Alex's fault
that the Jays treaded water/got rather unlucky in several seasons and never made the playoffs (see Pythag 2008)
No I know it's not his fault
But the common theme here is ownership.
I’m not placing my blame on Alex, and if it’s coming across that way, then I apologize. My problem is a corporation owning a team, particularly this corporation owning this team.
If they’re forcing this absolutely ridiculous budget on Alex, I don’t see how we can succeed in the AL East.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:27 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
Sorry if I frustrated you at all. Just my sadness has morphed into frustration.
Thanks for humouring me. Once again, sorry for my frustrating points.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:29 AM EST up reply actions
I bought into the AA revamp pretty hard
I was a fringe Tigers fan two years ago. But then I went all-in on the Jays.
I’m contemplating going back. Grass is greener, etc. As a Wings fan though, I can attest to the power of Mike Illitch. And it’s something that is never evident in Rogers’ ownership.
sigh
Now I’ll just look like a bandwagoner. And I love this band of misfits too much to leave.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:33 AM EST up reply actions
I don't really see where the budget talk is coming from
The company line ever since he took over has been
1) The goal is to build sustained success
2) When the time comes and the team is close, the cash will be there.
I can’t say I’ve seen anything yet that conflicts with either of those points. I think what has happened is people see the team moving in the right direction and get antsy and want to expedite the process because it looks like we’re closer than we are.
If this coming year ends up about where we collectively expect (84-90 wins depending on luck) and they fail to make any major moves next year, I could certainly understand where everyone is coming from.
And re: your post below: Now worries, it hasn’t come off like that at all. You’ve been easily the most measured of all the frustrated people.
Phew, glad I'm not coming across as a jerk
I rarely post because you are such a tight knit community, but I read everyday. Often I’ll read all 200+ comments too, but I just don’t have the courage to chime in.
I think this is just me looking for someone to blame. I won’t blame Alex because he’s doing a good job (though I do wonder what his first big signing will be like).
I won’t blame Farrell because this has nothing to do with this.
I kind of blame Beeston for saying that dumb quote, because it got a lot of people (including myself) buzzing about free agents and creating a false sense of expansion (also, I’m at fault for reading it that way)
So, I blame Rogers, the great faceless corporation who charges too much for average service. So why wouldn’t they provide an average product on the field?
It’s stupid, but I dunno. Just looking for answers in a pile of shattered dreams.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
you should comment! We welcome new members :)
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:41 AM EST up reply actions
I think it's that you're all so knowledgeable
But I doubled my post count at least tonight.
So I think the glass has been broken.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:42 AM EST up reply actions
It may look knowledgable from the outside looking in
But you likely know just as much as everyone else.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
and you’ll learn more by posting/commenting. People can be quite helpful
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:45 AM EST up reply actions
Well, please post more. The only way to get over the daunting-ness of the tight-knit community is to integrate yourself, after all.
Plus, more people → more viewpoints → more learning for all.
His first big signing was Bautista :)
I definitely get where it comes from. Being a sports fan requires behaving irrationally. It’s tough to have view business/team decisions through a rational lens when you have to suspend your disbelief to even care in the first place.
FWIW, they provided an on-field service that was exactly average by spending less than average, so that should be a good sign.
Debatable
I mean, I think there are a lot of fans here in this city that need the playoffs desperately.
The Red Sox not only saw the playoffs, but also a WS title. Dice-K may have had minimal impact, but he was a part of it.
And right now we have nearly 20 years (TWENTY YEARS) of not even close. So I think something’s gotta happen for fans to come out.
If Darvish meant playoffs, and AA didn’t get him, then there better be a damn good back-up that guarantees ALDS champs.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:57 AM EST up reply actions
I would argue that the Red Sox paid
exactly what they were willing to pay to win a championship. To each his own
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 1:02 AM EST up reply actions
the only thing disappointing would be to hear if we bid 50m thinking we would get him
because if we wanted him really badly, and though 50m or w/e we bid would get him, thats a huge disappointment that they didn’t bid 52m which i think would’ve been a safer bid after what dice-k got
I'd be more disappointed if they bid 35
knowing that it would take around 50 to get it done
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
They didn't know that
There were a ton of numbers thrown out. But it’s just false to use hindisght knowledge to colur your analysis. I’d be disappointed if they bid a penny over what they figured he was worth
the talk around here for montths had been around 50
if we knew that don’t you think they knew that too?
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
The operative word is “The talk”. The talk, is not a factual basis. That was coloured by little pieces of info reported here and there from anonymous agents and executives making gusses, each of whom may have had there own agenda. There was a massive spread in what different people thought
by MjwW on Dec 20, 2011 12:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
well if it were I
I’d have started my thinking at 50…if I wasn’t willing to go there, I wouldn’t play
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
Start at $50M
Because that’s what you determined his talent level dictated? Or because it’s more important to win an auction than to use your resources wisely?
no
because some bunch of fans on a forum thought the winning bid might be around $50M
a bunch of fans didn't pull it out of thin air
they used historical reference to pick a starting point. If Dice-K went for x amount and this guy is probably as good/hyped then x amount is a reasonable guess as to where the winning bid will be
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 1:06 AM EST up reply actions
No because if I wanted the player
I mean if I actually wanted the player I’d start there….if I decided he wasn’t worth 50 I wouldn’t have even bid
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
So
If you determined he was worth $35M, you wouldn’t bid $25M, when it doesn;t cost you anything to bid…then if you win great, and if you lost, no costs.
no I wouldn't bid
like many other teams didn’t
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
which is really stupid
because bidding gives you some upside and no downside
not really
if you don’t think you’re bid will win, don’t play. Why is that so hard to understand…..Seems many teams out there agree
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
so why not bid 1 dollar?
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:40 AM EST up reply actions
Taking an argument
To an illogical extreme does not do anyting for your argument. It’s called a straw man.
if it's "really stupid" to not bid at all
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
because anyone should be willing to pay $100 to talk to a great talent
I’d imagine all but the most cash strapped teams would bid, say, $3M too. maybe all the other GMs are idiots and hope everyone else bids low. there is literally no downside to bidding
There is literally no downside to putting in a bid at the exact amount at which you value the player
Other than twitter raising, and then destroying the hopes and dreams of your fanbase lol
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
what you're seeing here
and hearing on the Fan is the downside
Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?
by T.Dot_Bronco on Dec 20, 2011 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
Part of the problem
is that the Jays didn’t make any attempt to dissipate expectations.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
And they didn't do anything to raise them either
What are they supposed to do, put out a statement about every player, every time something hits MLBTR. I’d rather AA spent his time on improving the club
They tempered
expecations though. When people started favoring the Jays for Fielder AA came out and said that he thought it was unlikely.
by JaysSaskatchewan on Dec 20, 2011 12:52 AM EST up reply actions
I remember "the talk"
It was in the car with my dad at the beginning of a long drive to Montreal. Super awkward.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
agreed
my point was, if we really really wanted him at all costs, like say if we were actually willing to spend 60m if we wanted to, but we bid just 51m or 50m THINKING this would win the bid, and it failed. Well thats helladisappointing, and I hope that didn’t happen; not that we’ll ever know
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:30 AM EST up reply actions
i doubt that happened
the incentive in an auction is to bid your valuation (well maybe slightly below it because this is a 1st price auction not a 2nd price). if we valued him at $60M, no way we wouldn’t have bid close to that.
by Jono411 on Dec 20, 2011 12:32 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
unless we thought that bid would be what it would take to get him
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
but we have no way of knowing what other teams are bidding
so therefore there is no reason to bid much below our valuation
by Jono411 on Dec 20, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So your process is:
Establish a valuation. If you think the bid will be above the valuation, bid higher (burn money if you win) or don’t bid at all (even if it costs nothing, and you might win anyway if you bid near your valuation)
by MjwW on Dec 20, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
just because i set a valuation doesn’t mean i shouldn’t bet what I think it will take to get him to save myself millions
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
Okay
I’m at an auction. There’s a painting. I value the painting at $200. I know that others might bid more than $200. It costs me nothing to bid. I can bid $200, and if I win, great, and if not, no loss. I can not bid at all, in which case I have no shot at all (in case my understanding of the market is incorrect). Or I can bid more than $200 to make sure I win. Then I pay more than what I think the painting is worth. Big, whooping win that is
by MjwW on Dec 20, 2011 12:45 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
my point is
you might value it at 200 but think that everyone else only values it at 100. why would you bid 200 and waste that extra 100? you’d probably bid 110 or 120.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:48 AM EST up reply actions
Because unless you're a psychic
And can read your opponents mind (or they were dumb enough to tell you), then all you have is your gut instinct. And objective analysis beats subjective analysis every day of the week
50 million is a tonne of money, even to Rogers. I literally don’t know how I could spend that kind of money without burning it or throwing it away. I’m dissapointed that we didn’t get Darvish but in no way should Rogers be blamed unless actual proof is shown that they blocked a high bid. 50mil is a high bid.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I hate how I was happy with the team before this mess.
Now I look at the team and don’t get very excited. Argh
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Go the other thread
Watch all the highlight videos that were posted. The Lawrie walk off against the Red Sox never fails to cheer me up.
by MjwW on Dec 20, 2011 12:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he would answer
i didn’t know i wasn’t the highest!!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
i bet he wasn't smart enough to think of that!!
you will have his job in 3 years
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by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
wait, so thats not yuuu?
"I never argue with people who say that baseball is boring, because baseball is boring. And then, suddenly, it isn't. And that's what makes it great." - Joe Posnanski
by outoforder87 on Dec 20, 2011 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
Na, kindaa just slightly looks like Joey Kirby though.
Mine was a heavy sigh then five minutes of staring at a wall. Would be worst gif ever.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Is there any gifs of people getting WOW taken away from them? Those bids are LEET
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Apparently the jays bid was 51.1
A big, fat, FML.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST reply actions
please2cite sources
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
http://twitter.com/#!/onebluejaysway/status/148996651187572736
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:32 AM EST up reply actions
Mr elliot eh?
interesting
On the bright side we can say “they were willing to spend 51.1” when people say they are cheap
RIght? right? RIGHT??!?!?
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
Apparently the Jays bid was 51.69 million.
According to nobody.
Just trolling.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
sad thing is
this has just as much credibility as evertyhing we saw in the media/on twitter about darvish over the past week (other than the official announcement last night of course)
According to some reports out of Japan
Really? Why would anyone know the Jays’ bid?
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
Someone in the Jays could leak it.
No pros or cons now really. Except the fans’ pain.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
It would give no insight really except how highly they valued the player.
Which doesn’t matter at all.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Leak it to someone in Japan just so that it can be leaked back to Bob Eliot?
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:43 AM EST up reply actions
Wow the caller on Fan590, Antonio
Is pissed off that Rogers got Bautista, Romero, and Santos for cheap.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:32 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Paraphrased but
“They could’ve signed Madson for $30 million, but they refused to do that and instead traded their best prospect. They got rid of Halladay and Vernon Wells’ contracts. They just refuse to spend money!”
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
he must have got his facts from here
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by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
Why is this guy on for 5 minutes?
He just kept on saying that Rogers refuse to spend money. Repeatedly. And he re-misquotes Beeston. And he said that he won’t go to watch the Jays this year. Good riddance.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
It was funny
I understand his frustration, but it was misdirected. So was the “losing bid” guy. Why didn’t we bid 70 Million (note I don’t know or care how to use sarcasm font)
Leafs Talk caller.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
Ahahahaha
The guy on the Fan 590 is angry the Jays didn’t win, becuase he’s done his research and knows this guy’s stuff. The hubris of some of these people….
“Dice-K cost $50, this guy is better. What a joke” (paraphrasing). A good laugh is good on a night like this
agreed lol
half these callers are retarded.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
Come on, you're not 12. R-word is not accepted here.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
definition
slow or limited in intellectual or emotional development
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
you do not use a mental illness as an insult
its not politically correct
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:37 AM EST up reply actions
Last warning.
You are in our living room, we have our rules. You can exercise your freedom of speech somewhere else if you wish to not follow them.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
Kinda have to ban “idiot” “moron” and “imbecile” as well then.
(I obviously mean from the “calling anyone anywhere a [one of the above]” standpoint, not calling another commenter one, which is already a no-no.)
by Gerse on Dec 20, 2011 12:43 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
never got into DJF
not really sure why. never spoke to me the same way BBB does. I even like the writing there, too
Especially lately, they’ve really stepped up the articles. I rarely read the comments though.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
the comments there are /facepalm. I like the writing but sometimes the language gets annoying.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
not the same thing
and if you want to discuss changing of rules
Please forward all comments/questions to mr tom dakers
these are not up for discussion at this time, please move on
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:44 AM EST up reply actions
you can reach him here
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:44 AM EST up reply actions
lol
its not that big a deal. you all asked not to say it & i wont.
by TheMainEvent on Dec 20, 2011 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
good to hear
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
this conversation is over
if you any more concerns contact tom
Thank you
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
read this
http://johnb0127.hubpages.com/hub/Calling-Someone-a-Retard
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
hahahahhaa
noah_sherman
<blockquote>vaswani_ They thought it was The Price Is Right and bid $1 (I’m sorry)
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
fail
@noah_sherman
They thought it was The Price Is Right and bid $1 (I’m sorry)
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
quality post
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
DONT WORRY FELLOW JAYS FANS!
We have Jesse Litsch back to pickup Joey’s bat this year. Thats more than enough to get you all out for 8$ Nachos and 12$ Beers. Surely.
I dunno… I knid think I’m going to find a place to grab some swarmas and bring them in next time. On a related note, can anyone tell me where to get decent swarmas from around Union station to the Skydome?
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
this guy gets it
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
it is a poorly spelled shawarma lol
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
And now you’ve reminded me of the Roy Halladay beehive commercial…
/can’tletgo
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
awwww you made me remember :-(
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
Share the pain!! Probably the greatest promo ever, that or superstar Wells hiding in a dumpster. Ha ha, forshadowing.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
And Frank Thomas assaulting children!
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
pillow fight!
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 12:57 AM EST up reply actions
Shwarma
The chicken version of a gyro sandwich
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
Can't think of a good place down there. Lots around U of T and the Annex
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
that`s cool, sudden idea that struck me, and now I`m hungry. Hurray!!!
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
I don't know if an immediate reaction to this depression is to sleep immediately or not sleep at all :S
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Work tomorrow? I don’t so I’m up for a bit. I get so hungry when I drink.
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Winter break after last exam this weekend.
This was supposed to be happy times!!!!
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Meh Darvish will be nice but he is just gonna get moved to the bullpen when Daniel Norris,Justin Nicolino, and Aaron Sanchez come up
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
And then you totally redeem yourself!!
RGriffinStar Richard Griffin
Once again the dreams of Toronto’s key Iranian-Japanese fanbase are shattered by Jays failure to sign Darvish.
Unless I am missing something…
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
by Redonred on Dec 20, 2011 12:38 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
A joke. But he used to be the Expos' PR guy!!
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 12:40 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Just please AA, for the love of God
Promise that you won’t make me try to find the good in Mathis’ swing. Because I can’t do it. There are no metrics, both real and imagined, that can accomplish that feat.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 12:50 AM EST reply actions
AA did his best. It's disappointing, but it's time to move on.
With that said, I officially hate the Rangers and hope they lose the next two trips to the World Series to become the Buffalo Bills of the MLB.
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
by Frag on Dec 20, 2011 12:54 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I wanted to do the actualy lyrics from the Ceelo Green song.
But yea, probably wouldn’t fly on here.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Good call :-)
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 1:01 AM EST up reply actions
Good point
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
Listening to JaysTalk reaction
I have two related thoughts:
1) I really wish it was compulsory to take introductory economics
2) I;m very, very, very happy our GM has a degree in economics.
by MjwW on Dec 20, 2011 12:58 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Not expecting university grad level discussion on any talk radio.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:00 AM EST up reply actions
Huh?
My point is, if people understood ecnomics a little better, they would be a little more rational in thinking about these things
Rogers doesn’t care about spending! That’s why they posted the second highest bid on one of the biggest free agents to come out of Japan… wait.
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
Not really.
I know more than a few folks who should know better, but don’t. I’ve seen it at work, how other people conduct their personal finances, playing poker from time to time and ebay.
My comment was also a shot at talk radio in general (intellectual snobbery I guess.)
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:06 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, you're right
And no one is perfectly rational, etc. I just…ugh, listening to that is…wel, good for laughs and not much else. Cheap enterntainment for me
At least we don't have to listen to guys like Simmons, Cox, and Healy all the time
Listening to them for 2 seconds would cause my ears to bleed.
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
missed this one:
jparencibia9 jp arencibia
Rumors/Speculation are as cool as licking white dog crap! #WhyWeDontFollowThem #DontBelieveAnythingUntilItsForSure
As a Toronto sports fan I proudly follow the lessons of lachrymology.
"He drives that new car around town and feels really good about it." - Ron Wilson
"Vancouver, BC: A massive inferiority complex with a city." - TheOtherAndrew
"HOPE is more than a postponed disappointment" - Epica
Ew
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:00 AM EST up reply actions
Romero:
My people RELAX about the whole Yu Darvish thing. Stop freaking out. I have all the confidence in our team n u guys should too. We’re young n talented. Love, Ricky #jays
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
PANIC!
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
Sorry, unauthorized hotlinking of copyrighted material not permitted.
no, he's asking us to love him.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 1:03 AM EST up reply actions
Good night all
I wish things had gone better, but it’s just a shoulda, woulda, coulda event.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:01 AM EST reply actions
Yea I'm gonna go too
This thread will turn into the wild west
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 1:07 AM EST up reply actions
For the people with jobs.
You should definitely be sleeping. Someone call Woodman too. He’s gonna have a rough morning.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
i have a group meeting at 11 am
Yay for capstone
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 1:09 AM EST up reply actions
To tell you the truth
I am on Youtube listening to Whitney Houston performing “I Will Always Love You” for the fourth time in a row now.
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 1:09 AM EST up reply actions
I found CeeLo a little more soothing
With the JaysTalk GenerallySuperNuttyExtendoVersion in the background
Sorry, Rogers can't afford a Ferrari, but that don't we can't get Yuuuu here.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
But you don’t have the keys to the banhammer cabinet
Follow me @Minor_Leaguer
by Minor Leaguer on Dec 20, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
ha alright
just realised i’ve been trying to contact you in a email chain, without you being apart of it
Pretty much a sign i should sleep…
+1 is only good if you actually rec the post
by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
wow it’s after one. I should sleep too
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
During exams people talk about all-nighters like they're cool.
They’re not. You just get tired and don’t study well.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
yeah I tried doing one, but ended up crashing at three cause i just wasn’t retaining anything anymore.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:12 AM EST up reply actions
Yea that happens.
And if you’re lacking sleep during the exam…Well it’ll end badly.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
i had two 8AM exams, they were painful
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:16 AM EST up reply actions
The internet crashed when I was signing up for a lab in September so all the good times got filled up.
I now have an 8:30 lab every single week….I hate the internet.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Miss 3 and you get kicked out too
I haven’t missed any for the last 4 months but still got another semester of it :(
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
my labs are every other week, we only have five per semester
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:20 AM EST up reply actions
first one was tough, but not bad. The others were pretty easy. How bout you?
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:24 AM EST up reply actions
They were all a little shaky. Pretty meh.
Midterms went well so I have a good cushion at least.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
haha that’s good. I failed one of my midterms so I was nervous for that exam, I think I’ll be ok though.
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
I freaked when I failed that midterm too, I’d never failed anything before
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
I'd imagine that would be scary.
Do you have to maintain a certain mark or just pass?
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
just pass. And as long as I get a 40 on the exam I’m fine, since I did well on the other midterm and assignments. But yeah it was bad :P
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:37 AM EST up reply actions
What if Darvish decides to fall on his sword
over this whole posting process. Say demands 20 mill a year, or part of the Fighters posting reward.
Actually thought of this a few days ago— but of course it was then a fear I had that he might do it to the Jays!
Not saying I think it will happen, but I like to think it could happen.
I think it's kind of like sports lockouts.
Both parties want the same thing so badly, so they’ll probably get something done.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
Now what do you expect the Jays to do? Think they will go after Fielder? Jackson/Oswalt?
For what it’s worth, I think this won’t be the worst thing in the long run. That’s a lot of money.
Happy holidays!
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
its a yank, get him!!
Fielder would have to be 6 years or less, doubt hes going to want that.
I don’t think we add any more SP, just go with what we have for next season
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by Bowling_Guy25 on Dec 20, 2011 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
Will anyone even go 6+ for Fielder?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
I could see 6 for the Cubs maybe.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
I'm not sure
Seems Theo is very quiet on Madison
Maybe Theo is quietly waiting to pounce?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
No Fielder
I meant Madison Avenue. Not Madson.
Fielder is definitely a fit; just not sure if that is where the Cubs are leaning. They had/have a ton of bad contracts (team I follow in NL
I still think it's a logical destination
But I think they’ve probably made theri big splash, the financial room probably isn’t there.
Where to then?
His 8 year destinations are running out. Nationals? Or us at a 5 year huge money deal.
Or back to the Brewers?
Or Miami finds some extra cash.
I kind of hope
Boras screws this up. Fielder will still get paid; but I hope that he waits to long for 2 reasons:
1. Boras will look stupid
2. We could have a chance; though if that happens, he would likely go back to the Brewers.
That said; Nats will out bid themselves. And still suck…(Harper, Strasburg..damn)
I love #1. And I honestly don’t think the Brewrs have the cash for #2 anymore…having added A. Ramirez and having offered arb to Francisco.
Red Sox are out, since Ortiz will be back. Yankees…who knows, Doubtful, but you can never count them out. Seattle could be an options. LAD could miraculously pull out the cash, doubtful. I would imagine the Jays, notwithstanding all we’ve heard, are one of the top 5 possibilities.
I think Jays are very unlikely
But I just don’t see what other teams would be involved: Cubs, Nats, Marlins (only because they seem to have a never ending pit of money), Mariners have the need, but would they spend that? I didn’t think of the Dodgers.
It will be some oddball team like the Rockies and Todd Helton will retire.
No I agree
If I were handicapping, it would something like:
Nats: 4-1
Texas 5-1
Mariners 6-1
Brewers 8-1
Cubs 8-1
Marlins 8-1
Jays 10-1
Dodgers 15-1
Yankees 15-1
Orioles 30-1
They say they don’t have the money. Not sure if I believe them, though.
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
haha just like how they didn’t have money to bid for Darvish
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:35 AM EST up reply actions
Like the friend that never buys the food when you go out because "They have no money"
But then they buy an Iphone. Texas is that guy.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
by jays182 on Dec 20, 2011 1:38 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well would they lie about both?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Co-Manager/Writer for Pinstripe Alley, Editor/Writer for Blueshirt Banter
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
"Every day is a great day for hockey."
I wouldn’t think so, but who knows? Didn’t the Angels say they had no money too?
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:48 AM EST up reply actions
It's possible
I think it comes down to how big you see that market. They’re firmly mid-high market as it is, really to get Prince you’d be pushing the payroll closer to 150M than 100M for the next couple years (including Darvish)
Wait until the trade deadline
Clearly there’s not likely to be any deals to be had right now, so wait. Never overpay.
Besides which you’ll have a much better idea of what we need come June.
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:12 AM EST up reply actions
I would argue that we don't need another bat though
I mean, don’t get me wrong- I’d love one, but sixth most runs in baseball, while giving so many at bats to Nix, Rivera, et al.
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:16 AM EST up reply actions
point re: replacement players taken
but the difference in wOBA between BOS/NYY and Jays was the same, last time I checked, as difference between Jays and PIT (23rd in wOBA)
That that's only half the story
We don’t need to equal them in wOBA, there’s run prevention as well and neither of them was exceptional there
Need?
Want, sure. We we had a good offensse last year, and next year should be better already. Another bat would be nice, but not woth an overpay
Sure
I agree you can easily upgrade, if you want to, and that’s the obvious spot. But at what cost? And what’s the benefit. WHen you need to, you worry less about the cost. When you want to, you’re more slective.
we're nigh-definitely not good enough with that gaping hole
and I don’t see us getting there without one particularly with Bats’ inevitable decline
Okay – so who do you get? Not many FAs, maybe Beltran. Trades – Rizzo/Alonso maybe. Not a big pool of guys I’d want to bring in
He's gonna be costly.
If only to cover the production costs of that binder.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
I don't think that's much of a marginal upgrade
maybe 1 win if Lind is truly broken, plus you gotta trade one of the two (not bad, but the assets coming back won’t be worth much)
That I would agree with
But its not something that has to be dealt with immediately. Here’s hoping Bautista’s decline is still two or three years away.
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:25 AM EST up reply actions
but when is it immediate, then?
next summer when we have two good years left of Bautista? 2013, when we have one?
(I know you’re playing devil’s advocate in some capacity, so don’t take my stance as a personal attack plz)
I always think the best time to make trades is at the deadline.
More information for all parties, more incentive to do deals.
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
"Two good years of Bautista"
Say he’s a 5 or 6 win guys now. In two years, you’ve got a projection for 4 or 5 wins. He’s still good. It’s to simplistic to fit yourself into that line of thinking…and any decline will be offset my younger players improving moving along the aging curve
after I think about these long enough
I turn into JT caller lite. just sign Fielder and trade for Greinke+extension and make playoffz plzzz
Meaning you think he should be incarcerated?!
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:34 AM EST up reply actions
If Boras is asking 10 years, pass on Prince
Oswalt and Jackson will cost too much for what they actually bring to the table.
After the Yu bid, things are going to be quiet for a while unless AA pulls off an Xmas miracle and trades for another starter
Every time I want to go to bed someone asks an interesting question
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:13 AM EST up reply actions
I don't see it either.
But Boras is, well, pushy.
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:15 AM EST up reply actions
If AA could sign Fielder for 5 years, I'd be game if I were AA
But Boras has this hangup on 10
In honor of the Jays 2nd Baseman who played with fire in more ways than one.
by Damaso's Burnt Shirt on Dec 20, 2011 1:18 AM EST up reply actions
i agree
i just don’t see any team that would be willing to give him more than something like 7 years, $150 million, and even that’s pushing it. teams all know that while he’s an elite hitter, he’s a terrible defender and baserunner. they also know that he’s just hit what is the typical peak age and should expect to decline going forward.
the only teams that i could see signing him at this point are: jays, orioles, indians, mariners, marlins, nationals, cubs, brewers, rockies, giants. i’d be absolutely shocked if any of them gave him a crazy contract.
well to be fair
he’s terrible defensively relative to an average player. he’s not actually all that bad for a first baseman (not that that means much)
career defensive numbers (6 seasons):
UZR: -36
DRS: -48
TZL: -63 (doesn’t include 2011)
that’s somewhere between -6 and -12 per year. pretty terrible.
I suppose that's worse than I remembered
I recalled him being around -7 runs per year. while bad, that’s not Adam Dunn or Jonny Gomes
combining baserunning and fielding, he’s about 1 win worse per year than an average 1B. that would take about 20 points of wOBA to offset (in ~600 PA).
seems to me
most 1Bs lose value from Bsr though.
having now looked up the data, of 24 qualified 1Bs, only 5 had positive Bsr in 2011, ranging from 1.1 for Gaby Sanchez and 1.7 for Mark Trumbo.
19 1Bs had negative Bsr, ranging from James Loney and Adam Lind at -0.2 to Paul Konerko at -10.4.
an average MLB 1B lost 2.3 runs in 2011 from Bsr. that “recovers” about 5 points of wOBA for Fielder
I don’t care as long as we don’t overpay for an SP. I think we should be patient with the ones we’ve got in the minors
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:14 AM EST up reply actions
Actually, sure
At end of year who was in vegas that I’d regret giving up?
by BuffaloSojourn on Dec 20, 2011 1:17 AM EST up reply actions
d’Arnaud?
unless we mean last year’s 51’s
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:18 AM EST up reply actions
Yawn… off to bed. But damn what a bummer of a night. Why oh why if it couldn’t be us was it an American League team.
Good night everybody.
Tough night but hopefully AA will have some good news tomorrow. He may already by silent assassining as we speak.
Take care.
by eight_legged_freaks on Dec 20, 2011 1:46 AM EST reply actions
AA needs to get better at this game:
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
by jays182 on Dec 20, 2011 1:48 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Lone Star Ball Darvish Scouting report
Generated 1200 comments at last count (didn’t actually read it). This thread had over 800. Think two blogs had heavy interest in this?
LSB gets ridiculously large amounts of comments
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:53 AM EST up reply actions
I guess it makes sense, considering their world series trips these past two years
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:53 AM EST up reply actions
yeah. It makes me thankful for this place :D
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 1:57 AM EST up reply actions
I don't get the troll face "yu mad AA"
I doubt AA is mad at all. He bid what he valued the player at and lost. It’s not like the Rangers GM Daniels trolled him. Ugh whatever, I’m a sore loser.
"And I'm like forget Yuuuuuu"
probabl best for your sanity to stay off there tonight :P
by leaflover4ever on Dec 20, 2011 2:02 AM EST up reply actions
wow just went there and I def am rooting for LA in the west
I get that they’re happy about getting Darvish, but seriously? Dissing on us just because the media kept saying we were the favorites?
Especially not after Jays were gracious enough to give them the Napster
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
would've used sarcasm font if I knew how
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
thanks
I feel like Texas is a dog that turns on you even when you throw it a bone.
"I didn't really say everything I said."-Yogi ism
Missed the party
I’m disappointed that we didn’t get Darvish, guess i shouldn’t have convinced myself it was a done deal. Curse you Twitter and your false reports!!!
On a positive note, Texas winning saved me roughly $120 for a Darvish jersey!
Follow me on Twitter at @AlexDavidson68
Well Surprise, Surprise, Surprise
Love the idea of getting Yu, Would have loved watching him play for the Jays, etc. etc. etc.
But lets just take a step back here people!
1. At $55Mil posting and say $18Mil a year, without pro-rating, one year of Yu would be more expensive than the entire 2011 payroll ($70.5Mil plus change).
2. The best offensive player in baseball plays for the Jays and will get paid $14Mil in 2012.
3. The Rangers have not signed Yu Darvish yet.
4. What do you think his asking price will be? 6 X $20Mil? 7 X 18Mil? Would not be surprised if they can’t reach agreement, be surprised if they did and the total price tag wasn’t over $140Mil. C.C. Sabathia will cost $122Mil for the next 5 years.
by The commentator formerly known as Yoda on Dec 20, 2011 2:38 AM EST reply actions
Agreed. It's not the end of the world, or even Rogers Center.
One player doesn’t make a team that much better, and there’s still plenty of time before spring training.
by Defense Counts! on Dec 20, 2011 5:30 AM EST up reply actions
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