Kyle Drabek Demoted, Zach Stewart Called Up To Blue Jays
by Tom Dakers on Jun 14, 2011 3:13 PM EDT
in Toronto Blue Jays News
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The Jays have sent Kyle Drabek to Las Vegas and have called up Zach Stewart from New Hampshire to take his spot on the roster and, I presume, in the rotation. Zach has been great in his last 3 Fisher Cat starts, with a 2.37 ERA. Kyle....well you know. This happens just a couple of days after John Farrell said that there was no discussion about sending Kyle down, yeah right. It will be interesting to see Zach.
We'll add to this as we know more.
Update:
Wilner Thwipped this:
Farrell: We've got a young pitcher going on Sunday, and before the game I'm not gonna say he's in jeopardy of going to AAA.
That explains away the little lie to the press nicely.
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Curious
Not Mills, nor Cecil, but Stewart.
He was working on the changeup and apparently the Jays feel the changeup is ready. It’ll be hard for him to be more frustrating than Drabek. I really do hope young Kyle gets his confidence back.
I think Drabek just needs some confidence back and a gameplan change. He always could just use his stuff in the minors but when it started to get hit in the majors he started trying to get cute.
Considering that Drabek is only getting an O-swing% of 27.1% (League average = 29.4%), as well as a GB% of 44.8%, it’s obvious MLB hitters aren’t biting on his stuff and he’s not getting the groundballs that have helped him in the past. That spells danger for many pitchers, especially if they pitch in the AL East.
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
of course, that's a feedback loop
if you work from behind in the count, hitters have no incentive to swing at pitcher’s pitches.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
You could just look at his WHIP.
And seen it’s terrible. That, or the fact that he’s been getting shelled over the last month.
confused as to how what you're saying
relates in any way to what we’re discussing. No one is disputing that he has been bad, we’re talking about why.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
This happens just a couple of days after John Farrell said that there was no discussion about sending Kyle down
Hmmm. Does this sound like there may have been a disagreement between Farrell and upper management?
He also made this comment right after the game before him and AA could discuss it. It probably came up the next day after being able to rewatch all the tape etc and talking to Kyle.
i think he actually said it just before the game. so, it wouldn’t be the time to announce that they’re seriously considering it, less Kyle be checkin’ his tweets in the bullpen.
Personally I can live with a manager who will lie to the press to protect a players feelings
Over a manager who will throw a player under the press bus.
If Stewart take over Drabek's spot and start on Saturday, he would have 9 days rest since his last start was on the 9th
Do you guys that would be a good thing, should they let him start earlier?
It's wierd
He was starting to look a lot like Rick Ankiel there
Cecil
It’s Cecil’s confidence I hope this doesn’t break – the news must come as a bit of a slap in the face for him. I can see the Jays wanting to take a look at Stewart during this “prep” year
They probably told Cecil. Do that back to back for 2 more games and your back up. In fact heres your ticket to Toronto for 10 days from now, just to be prepared.
That would be one hell of a motivation tool. Leave his plane ticket in his locker.
woo hoo
looking forward to seeing Stewart. Hope he can keep the ball down and throw strikes.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
I agree
No knock on Cecil or Mills, but I’ve been itching to see Stewart pitch for the Jays.
Hic sunt fortuna dracones
This seems very stupid...we did the same thing with Kyle...brought him up from Double-A.
Why don’t we bring up Mills who has played very well for most of this year in a HITTER friendly league.
http://www.youtube.com/joeykirby14
by Joseph Kirby on Jun 14, 2011 3:24 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
If the reason for demoting guys like Snider and Drabek is because we want to win ballgames
Why not use Mills. Dude has a ridiculously low ERA for the PCL.
I'm thinking that when the Leafs win the Cup, I'll lose my drinking problem.
by leafsfan4life94 on Jun 14, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
They never once said it was to win ballgames. It was so they could fix whatever is wrong.
If you were a golfer and your swing had a big slice in it. Would you go out and play round after round in tournaments trying to improve it or would you go to the driving range? Thats what AAA is. Its the Driving range
by WizardofNaz on Jun 14, 2011 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thats a good analogy. I like it and I may steal it.
I think you'll find I'm universally recognised as a mature and responsible adult.
Twitter is the thing with all the tweets...
Really?
I seem to remember them saying something to that effect when Travis went down…
I'm thinking that when the Leafs win the Cup, I'll lose my drinking problem.
by leafsfan4life94 on Jun 14, 2011 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
This is usually one of those instances where the stats maybe dont tell the whole story. The organization obviously likes Stewart and maybe he was throwing the ball better in AA then Mills was. Just a thought anyways.
I think you'll find I'm universally recognised as a mature and responsible adult.
Twitter is the thing with all the tweets...
Stewart is a higher ceiling pitcher. They need to figure out if he can last as a big league starter if not I wouldn’t be surprised to see him moved to the pen in Sept to make him the closer
From Shi Davidi:
The Blue Jays have already seen Mills pitch in the majors while Anthopoulos said the double-A staff felt Stewart had earned the opportunity.
Translation: The Jays don’t think much of Mills and he’s not really in their plans for the future. Otherwise, seems to me he’d be the clear choice to call up now based on club need, his experience and performance at the moment.
I thought this would occur sooner or later with the way Drabek was pitching
The kid really needs to mature out there. He looked frustrated almost after every bad pitch he made (I know Pikachu will probably disagree with me about Drabek’s head affecting his game).
Though, it does surprise me that Stewart is getting the call-up. Guess Cecil isn’t ready yet, and they really don’t trust Mills?
"We are all agreed that your theory is crazy. The question that divides us is whether it is crazy enough to have a chance of being correct."
- Niels Bohr
hopefully we get to know more of the reasoning in the next few hours
by bowling_kid25 on Jun 14, 2011 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions
i guess...
the jays just wanted to control Kyle’s Super 2 status.
*ahem
Yeah, I really can’t fault them optioning Kyle. He was getting beat up by MLB batters and he needs some place where he can rework his plan of attack without added pressure.
This is great news
Drabek needs to find his mojo (and strikezone (and inner peace)) before returning. He gave us almost no chance to win his last several starts. Looking forward to seeing Stewart too.
...and make sure you vote for Jose
by craig in calgary on Jun 14, 2011 3:45 PM EDT reply actions
I think the kid is too fired up every game, he seems like such a perfectionist that every pitch he throws needs to paint a corner or induce a bat-tossing swing and miss. Inner peace just doesn’t seem like something that jives with Kyle.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 14, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
A lack of an ‘elderly’ starter doesn’t seem to help. All of them, except Villanueva and Litsch are the freak out kinds when things go badly.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:05 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Ironically, I think Halladay would have been a fantastic mentor. Halladay, like Drabek, was a hothead perfectionist at Kyle’s age and really got settled down by Mel Queen (I think). Halladay would probably be a great mentor for anybody though.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
What I don’t understand is why the organization doesn’t want pitchers to go to Vegas and call them straight up from AA and then when he struggles, in this case Drabek, they send him down to Vegas.
Hopefully Drabek can build his confidence back up, control his frustration and gain command of his pitches.
Looking forward to seeing Stewart.
I don't think they'd be worrying about numbers in Vegas for Drabek
Doesn’t matter what the dimensions of the park are… you should able to throw a strike anywhere.
Onions Baby Onions
Which is why I think every pitcher should go through AAA no matter what. Sure your numbers may not be as good but pitchers have to learn how to overcome tough situation since it will be much tougher in the bigs.
Wouldn’t it change a pitchers approach though if he knows he can’t pitch to contact as much because if they even make contact it’ll probably go for a hit?
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:00 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Good pitchers can figure out. The way I see it, a lot of Vegas hitters are fastballs hitters and journey man who can only hit fastballs. It can force you to throw more breaking balls and improve those pitches and keep the hitters off balanced.
You’re more likely to get swings on a breaking ball in the minors than in the majors though, so it still might not translate to success.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Feel bad for Drabek
Hopefully this is one of those times, where an experience like this can make you better. Maybe he needed to be “broken” before he could come into his own.
Secondly, I’m actually damn excited for Zach Stewart. I was really on him off-season. I think his stuff will stick in the AL East.
2011 Jays slogan should be "Power and Speed", not just "Hustle and Heart".
Proud member of the AL North
@VagabondBansal
I was really on him off-season
TWSS
I'm thinking that when the Leafs win the Cup, I'll lose my drinking problem.
by leafsfan4life94 on Jun 14, 2011 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Finaly the Drabek coloured glasses have come off.
I don’t think they were doing him any good leaving him up here to twist on the line.
It was starting to look like there was a double standard for any unsuccessful pitcher not named kyle. He needs composure and from there will come the strikes.
I don’t think this will be a short demotion even if he shows them something right away.
The Blue Jays are such a science project this year
I’d rather see the pre-season gameplan followed through more precisely. Griffin had a good article in the star today (amazing eh?), worth a read, some surprisingly intelligent observations made.
But the gameplan didn’t include Drabek struggling that badly. They gave him a ton of chances and he didn’t take advantage.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 3:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd agree with you Nadia
But I’m still mad for you beating me, on my “beat the slump” week.
2011 Jays slogan should be "Power and Speed", not just "Hustle and Heart".
Proud member of the AL North
@VagabondBansal
Haha, it was honestly a surprise to me too. I had Liriano benched cause he was on the DL earlier and of course he almost gets a perfect game. And this week Napoli is on the DL and Kinsler is on paternity leave till friday. What the heck is paternity leave anyways.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, that keeps happening to me.
And child leave = 12 months to be split amongst mother and father, depending on your employer.
P.S. I have a feeling MasterKembo is going to drop me even further this week. Those power rankings lied!
2011 Jays slogan should be "Power and Speed", not just "Hustle and Heart".
Proud member of the AL North
@VagabondBansal
Agreed...
Drabek appeared in free fall from start to start. No real positive momentum to speak of after his first few starts
by freethinkinged on Jun 14, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
He actually pitched well early on. It was a downward spiral after though, I agree.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, pitched well as in not a complete collapse.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He pitched 6 innings 6 times and 2 had even BB and Ks and twice more Ks than BB
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 4:26 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Alex Anthopoulos on PTS
Just uploaded: http://www.fan590.com/media.jsp?content=20110614_160425_12212
First half: AA was in New Hampshire last weekend and so he did not discuss the demotion with Farrell, so there was no discussion until Monday. AA also talked to Walton to ask if Drabek could have used a “breather”, wants to see him have some success in Las Vegas and “get back on track”. Drabek will be working on his command out of the microscope.
Second half: Zach Stewart was chosen over Brett Cecil because AA wants to see Cecil get a string of good starts with good command so that he will be recalled and not be optioned again. AA said that Stewart was almost a call up last season.
by Minor Leaguer on Jun 14, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think so
because of the “no starting a day game after a night game” thing, JPA wasn’t really starting 4 games a week; more like 3.5. I’d imagine it will stay about the same
Also… yay Thursday!… I have plans that will keep me out of the house all weekend so I’d have missed his debut if it were on Sat.
But Thursday is a 12:37 pm game :-(
Sigh I’ll be in a meeting at that time
by Minor Leaguer on Jun 14, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Kinda cool if its on Sat since its on the road(AA prefer rookies debuting on the Road)
but also its against the Reds, his former team though there are probably more pressure for Stewart. So i think thurs is good for all
Soo, not related but
Apparently it’s gonna be Reyes vs Halladay. Which sucks.
If the Phillies don’t mess with their rotation, Doc would be on Saturday July 2. Now I just need to convince someone to buy me nice tickets…
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 5:11 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Nice!
I’ve had tickets for that July, 2nd game for a while now and I’m just praying it’s Halladay pitching.
by TwoEyesForAnEye on Jun 14, 2011 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Someone mentioned the Phillies would ‘move’ Hamels up from 4th starter cause he’s pitched so well, but what does that mean? On paper or actually switching the order of starts. But that’d probably happen after the all-star break.
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 6:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Once Litsch gets fixed up and Drabek pulls himself together, there are 8 possible starters. Whoa
by Nadia on Jun 14, 2011 5:20 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Little off-topic...
So the Jays had an open spot on the 40-man from when they put Roenicke on waivers and that’s the spot that Stewart’s taken.
But that was going to be the spot for Lawrie, so when he comes back and is ready for recall, someone else will have to come off. Which could mean the end of Richmond/Nix? Someone else?
Also, what are the rules about taking someone off the 40 man? Could they for example take Drabek off the roster without putting him through waivers? Just wondering.
They haven't posted it yet...
…but when they do, listen to Greg Zaun on Prime Time Sports today. He had what sounded like a really good analysis of what was wrong with Drabek.
Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic
by bluejaysstatsgeek on Jun 14, 2011 7:24 PM EDT reply actions
Really? I like Zaun
I think you'll find I'm universally recognised as a mature and responsible adult.
Twitter is the thing with all the tweets...
Confidence Issue
I just read in an ESPN article that Drabek had said to the press that he could not remember the last good game he had pitched – I would assume those comments fed into the decision
…which is one of the factors that AA cited as a reason to send him down.
Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic
by bluejaysstatsgeek on Jun 14, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Huh.
Out of curiosity, a couple quick questions for you Jays folks:
1. Is Stewart a legitimate prospect? If so, where does he tend to rank on you guys’ prospect lists?
2. How many options does Drabek have left after this year now?
Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.
ARE YOU F#$%ING KIDDING ME!!!! ADAMS!!! JESUS TAPDANCING CHRIST YOU HAD 24 SQUARE FEET AND YOU MISSED IT ALL!! - OlenWhitaker
Certified Grabbo Lover, though only by accident.
I love lots of guys. - leaflover4ever
Stewart is a legit prospect
he started the year as the system’s top-rated pitching prospect after Drabek, and it is a system with a ton of pitching talent. He has his question marks, as do all pitching prospects, but he has a good fastball-slider combo, gets grounders, and has spent the last season developing his changeup and honing his control.
This was Drabek’s first option, so that’s not a concern. He has two more option years after 2011.
"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our closed rooms... The game of ball is glorious." - Walt Whitman
I'd be worried with Drabek
His command completely deteriorated this year, and despite that, he still should have been able to K some guys with his stuff. Except he didn’t. It’s not just for this year, either. He posted relatively pedestrian K rates in his minor league career, as well as last season.
He really lacks pitchability, and I think that’s his biggest problem right now. Of course, that’s not to lessen the severity of his command woes; walking 6.3 batters per nine, even for a rookie in the AL East, is unacceptable.
Drabek could very well be a big disappointment if he doesn’t start putting things together.
Everyone should just relax
Kyle Drabek is a kid, he’s just 23. He skipped AAA on his way up, which if not uncommon, people should remember that’s equally not uncommon for such pitchers to fall back to AAA with possibly several seasons of back and forth.
Does Drabek seem lost now? Yes. Is his first real time struggling getting to him? Yes. But I say great, adversity and one deals with it can be the best growing experience in life. So let him eat some humble pie and learn how to rise above adversity.
Drabek’s got great baseball genes and upbringing that will continue to serve him well, with a bulldog tenacity that will help drive him forward once he learns to get his emotions in check, especially when it comes to overcoming struggles.
I remain very excited to watch him develop and wouldn’t be at all bothered if he spent the rest of the season at AAA. We’re too impatient these days and the 2-3 months left of this AAA season aren’t much at all. Learning doesn’t happen overnight.
by jabalong on Jun 14, 2011 10:26 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
I'd been saying that for a while
I could name a dozen young power pitchers (with good “stuff” – that one’s for you Hess) that struggled with control early in their careers. on the radio broadcast Jerry and Alan noted that Farrell pointed out Buchholz’s and Lester’s early career control problems, to name a couple. Drabek has at least until the AS break next year before things get hairy. we’d all love to see him come in and immediately be solid (like Ricky did) but Kyle has 2 fewer years of experience than Ricky did. it sucks that Kyle’s having (bad) growing pains, but it’s not even approaching time to consider panicking yet
Not sure anyone isn't relaxed
reading the comments, it looks like everyone agrees he should be sent down, its just shocking after they said they hadn’t discussed it.
by bowling_kid25 on Jun 15, 2011 8:00 AM EDT up reply actions
About time for me
The kid wasnt throwing strikes and when he was they were up in the zone getting smoked. They’ve probably been thinking about it for a while now but his somewhat decent performance vs KC probably extended the inevitable, but his god awful start last Sunday more than likely sealed the deal for me
It's a good thing we're hip-deep in starting pitching this year.
Otherwise we’d be stuck with slumping pitchers in the bigs.
by Defense Counts! on Jun 14, 2011 11:54 PM EDT reply actions
We are?
I think we have 1.5 reliable starters in Romero and Villanueva. Everybody else is frustratingly inconsistent (Reyes, Morrow), injured (Litsch), or consistently bad (Drabek, Cecil to some extent).
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
all right,
so we have 3 teams. the best team in the Majors, the best team in the NL, and a team that made the playoffs last year. it seems the Jays don’t, in fact, have a pitching staff in the 90th percentile of MLB teams
This is a very semantical debate. Relative to other teams in the league, the Blue Jays’ staff is wildly inconsistent. The way Morrow goes from dominant to embarrassing is not normal. Drabek gets shelled every time we send him out. Reyes is Reyes. At this point in time, this is not a good pitching staff. Including Romero and Villanueva, it is a slightly below average staff, look at sortable team pitching stats: 26th in ERA, 26th in WHIP. This staff is not good.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 8:14 AM EDT reply actions
Oops, that's a reply to you benk.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 8:15 AM EDT up reply actions
love that "Reyes is Reyes"
Jo Jo Reyes has a 4.6 ERA, and a FIP and xFIP right around his ERA. that’s excellent for a back of rotation starter.
ERA and WHIP are truly horrible short-term estimators of true talent, especially when you have a young guy like Drabek skewing the means so much. the Jays are 25th in team xFIP, which has the same issues as ERA and FIP in terms of mean skewing, but while 25th is hardly good, just .12 points of xFIP separate us from the 14th best xFIP in the league.
The way Morrow goes from dominant to embarrassing is not normal.
yes it is. it’s called Young Power Pitcher Syndrome.
Advanced statistics are great, they offer perspective that ordinary statistics cannot, but the bottom line is that the Jays’ rotation gives up too many runs, hits and walks. Reyes has been better recently but he give up too many hits, has been getting lucky on hr/fb and isn’t getting too unlucky on BABIP. However, like you say, for a 5th starter we could do much worse.
Morrow is a different story though, he was consistent last year for a long stretch and was absolutely dominant at home. The article analyzing his pitches detailed that he has stopped using his secondary stuff and has basically thrown fastballs and sliders, making him very predictable.
The rotation is poor, and considering that the Jays are top 5-10 in every major offensive category, it makes sense that they hover around .500 with the quality of pitching they’ve been getting.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
dominant at home
to me, basically means what you said: inconsistent. it means you don’t have your best stuff roughly 1 in every 2 starts, so why are you saying that that shows he was not as consistent last year?
the last sentence made no sense
it should say “that’s not evidence that he was more consistent last year”
Because he wasn’t making a fool of himself on the road, he was above average while at home he was beastly. This year he’s just alternating between good/terrible starts, it’s very obvious to me that he was more consistent last year. But none of this is very relevant, Morrow is one pitcher, there are four other pitchers in the staff that are responsible for the staff ERA.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
yep
Ricky’s good, Villanueva’s a good stopgap, Reyes is a good no. 4 guy, Morrow is inconsistent, and Drabek/Cecil were horrible and are brutally skewing the numbers.
I’m not sure I want Reyes here going forward, but for now we could be doing much worse. I hope that Morrow figures his stuff out and that Drabek and Cecil turn themselves around, especially Brett. But for now the rotation gives me heart palpitations, minus Romero of course.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, it's tough
especially most people (myself included) supposed our top-3 would be very good this season (Romero/Morrow/Cecil) and Drabek would adjust well enough, with a stopgap at 5. I really hope the pitchers can step it up in the second half
Yeah me too, I figured we would have a solid staff and an anemic offense but that hypothesis got flipped on its head. Unless we start getting production out of 3B and the staff becomes more dependable this team is doomed to .500. Romero has proved me wrong though, I had pegged him as a second tier starter but he’s been dominant, his peripherals get better every season. Hopefully our pitching pipeline can produce some solid starters but at this point I’m actually quite concerned.
by scrambles the death dealer on Jun 15, 2011 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions
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