State of the Rogers Centre

by BlueJays96 on Feb 22, 2012 9:15 PM EST

In My Opinion:

Going into the 2012 season I always hear “fans” complaining about how the dome has no energy and how it’s hard to enjoy a game when there is no atmosphere. Personally, I agree with this sentiment, I feel when I’m supporting my team I shouldn’t have to be shushed whenever I cheer or boo. Which actually has happened to me in the past. I don’t think this is the fault of the Rogers Centre. I believe this is the fault of the fan base. The Rogers Centre actually can be an amazing place to watch a baseball game. I’m not old enough to be able to have experienced the championship days. Though I did experience the 2009 World Baseball Classic, I watched the Canada VS USA game and it was electrifying, every little play was received with amazing reaction. It was great feel so much energy in a place where I have spent so much time, without ever really getting that feeling. So, I know for the dome to get more filled the Jays will have to start winning more games, but this is a young energetic team that should be exciting to watch. I also don’t think the fans should wait until they start winning. This just might be my hopeless optimism speaking, but if more fans started making their way to games and getting the crowd energized, maybe that’s the first step to winning. From there, it would just be a positive feedback cycle. More fans at games -> Jays play better, and win more games -> less die-hard fans start filling the dome. I know it is not that simple, but I think if people stopped complaining and actually attended a lot of games, it could be a step in the right direction. Maybe the Rogers Centre would even be electrifying again in the near future!

What are your opinions on the state of the Rogers Centre and the atmosphere that comes with it?

-Isaac (@BlueJays1996)

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Home field in advantage in baseball is very small

Something like 54%-46%, compared to 60-40 in NFL. So really, that chain of causation breaks down

by MjwW on Feb 22, 2012 11:13 PM EST reply actions

He may be talking indirectly, but like in high school math when they want you to show all the inbetween stuff, he left out some steps

More fans →More Money →More FA Spending →More wins →More fans → Less non-fans

He gets the marks for the answer but he gets marks off for not showing his steps.

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 12:56 AM EST via mobile up reply actions

Well, not according to the causal mechanism that outlined

More fans at games → Jays play better, and win more games → less die-hard fans start filling the dome

My point was, the link between more fans anf the Jays playing better is pretty tenuous (at best).

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions

But if you insert

“→Increased revenue→Increased FA spending→” between points A and B then there’s something there for sure. But, the direct effect is marginal if existant, agreed.

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 1:11 AM EST via mobile up reply actions

Ah okay, gotcha

I don’t think that was exactly what was meant, given the preceding sentence “but if more fans started making their way to games and getting the crowd energized, maybe that’s the first step to winning”.

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 1:20 AM EST up reply actions

Again

if you either take out “and getting the crowd energized” or add something after it like “it will create an atmosphere that will attract more fans (like BMO field for TFC)” then it would make total sense. But of course, as written it may be inferred that he meant for a home-field advantage.

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions

Living in Alberta, I can only go to games very occasionally...

but from my limited experience, if they didn’t allow young men who like to drink a lot the games would be much more enjoyable! I enjoy cheering for the Jays but I don’t heckle the other team, no matter who they are. Listening to these guys yelling at the other team or even Jay players who they don’t feel are performing up to speed makes the whole experience unpleasant for me. (I’m not trying to be sexist here, it just seems that the ones who heckle are males who have had too much to drink.) There have been times when I’ve gotten up and moved from my seat to get away from them.

I don’t know what the solution is but I do wish that if people who are supposedly cheering for the home team but want to yell at them would just stay home and yell to their television. In my opinion there needs to be more enforcement at the games. Everyone has the right to cheer or boo if they like, but they don’t have to right to be excessive in that it disrupts the enjoyment of everyone around them.

There have been games I’ve attended where there was a lot of positive energy and it did make the experience truly enjoyable. It all depends on the people sitting around you and unfortunately that can’t be chosen when you choose your seat.

If you can't convince them, confuse them!

by Carm on Feb 22, 2012 11:17 PM EST reply actions 2 recs

Bang on

There have been games I’ve attended where there was a lot of positive energy and it did make the experience truly enjoyable. It all depends on the people sitting around you and unfortunately that can’t be chosen when you choose your sea

Its always this and if you go to the bigger games, the give aways, jr jay saturdays, canada day, sox vs yankees, odds are you will have the experience you want.

I’ve really never been to a game where it was silent, but then again i always cheer, control your own energy and it will affect those around you

+1 is only good if you actually rec the post

by Bowling_Guy25 on Feb 23, 2012 11:23 AM EST up reply actions

I went to a gave in August vs KC last year

it was like a library

Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?

by T.Dot_Bronco on Feb 23, 2012 9:27 PM EST up reply actions

I was at the Canada vs. USA WBC game you talked about.

I think it’s the best sporting event I’ve ever been to. It was epic.

I don't always have exams, but when I do they are DURING the Jays home opener.

by jays182 on Feb 22, 2012 11:25 PM EST reply actions

I was there too

couldn’t agree more.

by SuckaMD on Feb 25, 2012 11:22 AM EST up reply actions

I was in right field bleachers right where the last out was made :(

It was sad.

I don't always have exams, but when I do they are DURING the Jays home opener.

by jays182 on Feb 25, 2012 12:53 PM EST up reply actions

I’ve easily been to a hundred games at the ‘dome in my life, and I can count on one hand the number of times that people have been shushed. Of those, I can only think of one that wasn’t warrented. The ushers rarely, in my experience, shush people for booing opposite team players. The shush them because they’ve been drunkenly screaming for twenty solid minutes the same ‘Yankees suck’ with their five equally tanked buddies while everyone around them has their hands over their ears. Or they get shushed for screaming loadly their opinion that the opposing pitcher has had sexual relations with his mother on multiple occasions, likely while providing oral stimulation to the umipire at the same time. Most times this happens, two rows down sits a family of five, which always includes a precoious eight year old trying to get his dad to explain what they mean.

I’ve heard hundreds of ‘honest to goodness’ accounts of the horrible Rogers Centre staff ready to pounce on any display of fun or enjoyment during a game and laughing manically as the offender is tossed from the gate DJ Jazzy Jeff style a la the Fresh Prince. After they’ve taken out his wallet, called his mate an ugly cow, and mentioned that they all secretly root for the Red Sox. But I seem to miss all of these, and instead, normally get cheerful, or at least politely courteous treatment from the ushers, few issues, and the odd time something has been out of kinter in my section, seen it dealt with as fairly as possible under the circumstances.

So, obviously the answer is to attend games that I’ll be at, and sit in the same section.

by dexfarkin on Feb 22, 2012 11:57 PM EST reply actions

I agree

I thought it was awful at last years season opener, when all the drunk people in the outfield were just throwing things onto the field for no reason… its embarrassing really!

by BlueJays96 on Feb 23, 2012 6:59 AM EST up reply actions

I can't stand

when people run onto the field either

Excuse me, do these effectively hide my thunder?

by T.Dot_Bronco on Feb 23, 2012 9:29 PM EST up reply actions

I've long said

tongue-halfway-in-cheek, that if someone runs onto the field, the security guards should wait 2 minutes before going after them. During that time, the players should have free reign to beat down on the person.

by SuckaMD on Feb 25, 2012 11:23 AM EST up reply actions

I think the security should let these idiots run free on the field, focus on protecting the players instead.

After a minute or so of running around by themselves in front of thousands of people, delaying the game (and likely getting booed) these tools will realize what an embarrassment they are. Without the thrill of the chase they will give it up pretty quickly, then they have to slink off the field into a pissed off crowd where they will likely hear about how stupid their actions were.

Security can probably pick them up pretty easily by then, it will probably be a relief for them to leave the game.

by transmogrifier on Feb 25, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions

plenty of morons cheer for them

and I don’t think they’re really in the right state of mind to realize the stupidity of their own actions…

I tweet.

by benk on Feb 25, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions

Neat idea

But the reality is, most of these guys have too little blood in their alcohol to realize how embarrassing/moronic it is.

by MjwW on Feb 25, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Personally...

…I prefer to watch at home. I hate the noise of crowds. I hate loud, obnoxious, drunk, crude yahoos jeering and cheering. (I enjoy a good jeerer and heckler, but honestly, they’re VERY rare.) I can see replay at home. Beers rarely cost me more than $3/bottle, and when they do, they’re VERY worth it (and would cost over $20 if they were offered at the Skydome. there is nothing, food-wise, that attracts me to the Skydome. Even the Nathan’s (Kosher) Hotdog that’s so hard to find was “Meh!” I don’t have lineups for the washrooms, which are far cleaner and smell far better that the Skydome washrooms ever have since 1990.

And I didn’t even mention my chair!

Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic

by bluejaysstatsgeek on Feb 23, 2012 1:07 AM EST reply actions

I tend to agree with this

There’s 81 games a year so each one seems less like a spectacle than an NFL game, MLS game or even an NHL game. It becomes more of just a ritual, like watching your favourite tv show or the news.

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 1:14 AM EST via mobile up reply actions

I mostly agree

I go to 2-4 games a year, and it’s mostly for the experience. There’s still something to walking through the tunnel and seeing the whole field, the expense of seats, the Jumbotron – I still find it as cool as the first time I saw it as a 9 year old. I don’t hate the noise of crowds (indeed, I usually contribute my fair share of (completely sober) yelling, though much less than when I was a kid).

But the rest I agree with. I’m very, very cheap, and I have not bought a single beverage or item of food in Rogers Centre the last 5+ years. The only thing I buy – everytime – is a program to score the game, and to add to my collection. And really, this is the only thing that hasn’t experienced crazy inflation- they were $5 15 years ago, and are still $5 (of course, there’s a lot less material, but I barely read that, since I just score the game and keep it as a memento, like some people keep stubs).

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 1:30 AM EST up reply actions

Also

One thing I’ve found the couple years is how much more I enjoy the games with Fangraphs, Pitchf/x, etc at my fingertips

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions

My key to enjoying the game

Is bringing my old portable AM radio, so I can listen to the broadcast simultaneously. I prefer that over the At Bat App while at the game. I love hearing the play-by-play while watching the action.

@VagabondBansal

by Vagabond13 on Feb 23, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions

MjwW...

…you’re sound very much like me, except that I don’t score the game.

I generally listen to the radio with FGs and Gameday in two windows of my computer. This season, my first with cable, I may have the TV on in the next room to see replays.

Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic

by bluejaysstatsgeek on Feb 23, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions

What does Fangraphs offer during the game?

Or is it just so you can see more stats when a guy comes up than just maybe the triple slash, HR and RBI?

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions

They have their own boxscore

With WPA charts (I love WPA for telling the sotry of the game), in game FIP (for when I’m too lazy to do the mental math and approximate it), and the of course in depth stats when I want to look something up, or situation matchups, etc

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions

In-game FIP? like for the game or cumulative?

Yeah WPA`s alright, I understand what people see in it, but to me, I`m just cool with approximating it myself, ie “man this is a huge AB!” or “he’s gotta get this guy out!”

by T_Mizz on Feb 23, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions

The game

by MjwW on Feb 23, 2012 2:51 PM EST up reply actions

I don’t get that. I mean, I enjoy watching the games at home, certainly, and the advantage of having the television coverage and everything is nice. But, really, choosing that over a chance to see the ‘whole’ game? Maybe it’s just the defensive nerd in me, but I like picking up a lot of the things that ‘follow the ball’ television coverage doesn’t get; defensive shifts, the way guys move to cover bases, the relaying of signs, etc. Maybe it comes from playing for years, but seeing how guys are leading off and the depth the fielders shift to for me is an important part of understanding how a game is managed and strategized.

Then again, I feel the same way about soccer and hockey; really enjoy going to see a match or game live, but find the television coverage cuts out half of what’s going on.

by dexfarkin on Feb 23, 2012 8:51 AM EST up reply actions

Yes, it's nice to see...

…the whole game, but if you’re looking at something Thames is doing in LF before the ptich and Romero throws a pick-off to first that is really close, too bad, you missed it, because close plays are NEVER replayed on the JumboTron.

Furthermore, I go to watch a game. I don’t give a rat’s a** about all the ridiculous in game promotions – there a distraction and noisy.

Hugo thinks I'm a lazy academic

by bluejaysstatsgeek on Feb 23, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions

See, I have the MLB.tv app, so if I want to rewatch something, I can get it on my phone.

Maybe it’s a generational thing, but going to a game to me is baseball. I can ignore waves and the mexican hat dance and the stupid competitions as an afterthought. I don’t mind overpaying for a beer and a hotdog because I accept that’s part of the price. So I sit there, eating my hot dog and drinking my beer, scoring the game, sharing the peanuts with my girlfriend, and there’s something simply beautiful about that. Something my dad said to me once was the the sound of going to the ballgame never changes; the details shift, the music is different, the volume varies with the size of the crowd, but the sound of the well struck ball is the same. The sound of breath being sucked in by everyone as a batter gets around on it and you have that second and a half of everyone tracking the arc before you realise it’s gone and the roar that follows; that he said is the same as it was 65 years ago when he went to his first real game.

Probably overly sentimental, but I’d never pass up a chance to watch a game live in exchange for more details and replays and live updating of my fantasy teams.

by dexfarkin on Feb 23, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

What!?!

Even the Nathan’s (Kosher) Hotdog that’s so hard to find was "Meh!"

dude i look forward all year for those hot dogs!
ya they’re crazy expensive and the lines are always long but thats part of the experience!
its things like that that make the ball game!

I am the Walrus

by yleviticus on Feb 23, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs